October 2012 - Dialogue - lists.wedgeblade.net

10/11/12, Spong: The Presidential Campaign and the Book of Judges
by Ellie Stock 13 Oct '12

13 Oct '12

HOMEPAGE MY PROFILE ESSAY ARCHIVE MESSAGE BOARDS CALENDAR The Presidential Campaign and the Book of Judges A major debate in this year’s presidential election eliciting great emotion and spirited rhetoric relates to “the size and role of the federal government.” A study of American history reveals that this theme has been part of every campaign since our nation’s founding in 1776. It has become a once every four-year ritual, complete with pious clichés that are constantly repeated. It appears, interestingly, to matter very little which party gets elected, since the size of government seems not to change from election to election. Indeed, studies indicate that the size of the federal government and the amount of the federal debt tend to grow more rapidly under the Republicans, the presumed “anti-big government” party, than they do under the Democrats, the presumed “pro-big government” party. For example, the size of the federal government and the federal debt expanded under Republican Presidents Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush and contracted under Democratic President Bill Clinton. It expanded again under Republican President George W. Bush until it ended in economic collapse. It has been the role of Democratic President Barack Obama to begin the slow walk back to fiscal balance. A major issue in this campaign is whether or not he has done that task adequately. The facts of history simply do not uphold the political mantras that the Republicans are for small government and the Democrats are for big government. If this nation was really offered “a stark choice” in every election, as both parties always claim, then why does nothing happen to the size of government no matter who wins? Something is clearly going on in our electoral process that is apparently not rational, something we do not see or do not want to see. From where then does this false debate arise? The answer to this question became clear to me recently and it occurred in an unexpected place. During the year, I teach an adult class at my wonderful church, St. Peter’s, in Morristown, New Jersey, a congregation served by two incredibly gifted clergy. My subject matter for this year’s class is “The Rise of the Prophetic Movement in Israel,” covering 16 books in the Bible, from Isaiah to Malachi. To place the prophets into the story of the Hebrew people I introduced the class briefly to the history of Israel after the Exodus from Egypt, but before the Hebrew people moved to establish the monarchy of King David. That was a time of local government, tribal chieftains and a deep suspicion of all non-local forms of political power. All of this is reflected in the book of Judges, filled as it is with stories of tribal heroes like Deborah, Jael, Jepthah, Ehud, Gideon and Samson. As I read Judges in preparation for this class, I began to understand the nostalgic roots of my own country and indeed the way all nations have come into being. Nation states with clearly defined federal governments are a relatively recent human phenomenon. Italy and Germany did not become unified until the 19th century. In the Middle Ages, Europe was a continent of local tribes like the Goths, the Franks, the Huns, the Saxons and the Visigoths, who roamed the land with shifting boundaries, cut off from other tribes only by rivers or mountains. I look at Afghanistan today and I see a picture of pre-modern Europe. President Karzai is said to be the elected head of that nation, but the effective power outside the city of Kabul is held by local chieftains. I look at our closest ally, now called the “United Kingdom,” but it still reflects the ancient dividing lines that separated the English, the Welsh, the Scots, the Cornish and the Northumbrians just to name a few of that nation’s tribal parts. I look at my own nation, born in a revolutionary war in 1776, but unwilling to adopt a federal Constitution until 1789. No central government in history appears to have been born out of choice, but rather out of some survival necessity. There is in the hearts of human beings an almost universal fear of any external power that cannot be controlled or tempered by local desires. During the period of the Judges the Hebrew people were forced to choose a king only because the alternative was for the individual tribes to be picked off and conquered by the Moabites, the Edomites or the Philistines. Samuel, the last of the judges, warned the people about the abuses of federal power. He actually sounds like a contemporary politician. The central government (the king), he said, will draft your sons into its armies to fight its wars; it will tell you what you can plant on your farms, and it will tax you for the support of the government. When Samuel, bowing to pressure, finally named a king, he chose Saul, a member of the small and non-threatening tribe of Benjamin, who suffered from melancholia and was ultimately too weak to solidify his throne. I suspect that was a deliberate choice by Samuel. When Saul was killed in battle, his military captain, David, a powerful personality from the dominant tribe of Judah, moved immediately into the leadership vacuum and created a unified nation. King David did not end the yearning for local rule, but he and his son, Solomon, did suppress it for 80 years, after which a successful civil war localized the Hebrew people once again until their yearning for survival reestablished itself in 1948 in the modern-day state of Israel. In America, something quite similar occurred. This nation went from a successful revolutionary war against being ruled from London into a confederacy of thirteen independent colonies each with a ruling governor and a local legislature. Only through a long and difficult political debate that was focused in a series of publications known as the “Federalist Papers,” was the compelling case made for the creation of a federal union. These “Papers” were produced anonymously, but we now know they were written by James Madison, Alexander Hamilton and John Jay. They made the familiar case that creating a united country was the only alternative to having the colonies picked off one at a time by the European powers, England, France and Spain. A Federal Union was a necessity for survival, but it was not something the people welcomed. Still fearful of federal power, the framers of our national constitution wrote protections into that document for the rights of the states. That is why we have today a balance of power between the House of Representatives and the Senate and why we elect a president through the votes of the states in an electoral college and not by the direct votes of the people. Deep in the human psyche, there is still the memory and the fear of having our freedom oppressed by some power. It was Egypt for the Hebrews, King George III for the Americans and “federal power” for many today. The negativity expressed in every national election against the federal government is rooted in this nostalgia, but the reason curbs on federal power will never be successfully implemented is that the America of today could not be governed by the local world view of our romantic past. So we will talk about it in every election, but we will never really do anything about it. Look at the contrasts between the America of 1776 and the America of today. In 1776, this country had less than 3,000,000 people. today we have 350,000,000. In 1776 people grew most of the food they ate on their own land or they killed it in the hunt with their own guns. Today, most of our citizens are separated from the farm by incredible distances, both physically and emotionally. A massive and non-personal food industry, made up of giant corporate farms, meat packing companies, automated chicken farms, canneries, fisheries and national grocery store chains are required to feed this population. None of these institutions today can be managed or have their quality and safety guaranteed locally. In 1776, people traveled by horse and buggy and seldom ventured more than 25 miles from their homes. Today, we are a nation of highways, gas stations, repair shops, auto dealers, rail lines and bus stations, and airports and air travel, none of which can be organized or governed locally. In 1776, communications were quite primitive. All newspapers were local, there were no telephones, radio stations, television channels or Internet providers. None of those modern means of communication can be organized or controlled locally. In 1776 in most homes and public buildings there was no running water, no electricity, no central heating and no garbage collection. Community needs were served rather with individual wells, outhouses, wood burning fireplaces and local garbage dumps. None of the things that we depend on so totally today like water departments, gas and oil companies, electricity providers and waste managements companies could now be organized or controlled locally. In 1776, churches, private charities and people who personally knew the poor took care of those who were in need. The care for the elderly was by and large a family responsibility. There were no hospitals or drug companies. There was no Social Security, Medicare or standardized medical procedures. All of those had to be created, maintained and governed for our well-being outside the local community. Nostalgia for local rule remains, stories of the good old days abound, but no one will finally return to that era or to those practices because none of them would work in our complex interdependent world. So in our political campaigning, we will continue to run against “big government,” but no matter who gets elected, no clock can ever turn back to the days of local rule and states rights so only the talk will go on. The reason one knows that this political debate is not real, is regularly demonstrated in that the political party most dedicated to small government is also the same party that wants the government to control the most intimate human decisions in regard to reproduction and family planning. They want no federal control in their lives except for the federal imposition of their own moral code. It does not compute. I did not understand why, however, until I began to read the book of Judges. It is amazing how powerful biblical insights can emerge once one stops pretending that the books of the Bible are the literal words of God and read them for the wisdom they impart. ~John Shelby Spong Read the essay online here. Question & Answer Lydia from Machesney, Pennsylvania writes: Question: What if it was discovered that Christ had a "near death" experience? Is it possible? What effect would it have on Christianity? Answer: Dear Lydia, I think your imagination has been working overtime! First, everything we know about Jesus is located in the four gospels that are not eye witness accounts, but the products of the second and third generations of Christians, written 40 to 70 years after the event we call the crucifixion. So they are interpretations of Jesus not factual reporting. If Jesus had had an out of body experience, all we would get to read about would be how it was interpreted 40-70 years later. Second, an out of the body experience, at least as I have read about them is a subjective experience not participated in by anyone, but the subject. I think that what people call out of body experiences can be explained quite naturally, but I know of no verifiable data of a person, who is “out of the body” making himself or herself known to other people. If I did read an account that claimed that, I would not believe it or would ascribe it to hallucination. The Jesus story is based upon a person who lived in history and with whom people had intense experiences, which they interpreted as the presence of God enabling them to transcend the normal limits of mortality. Our problem is that we have literalized those experiences and written creeds, doctrines and dogmas on the basis of those literalizations. Your question seems to me to be the result of seeking, either consciously or unconsciously, to escape these creedal structures and find a new way to interpret these experiences. I commend you for that. To walk down the road of “out of body” literature is, I believe, little more than a dead end street. ~John Shelby Spong Announcements Any questions or concerns, please contact us at support(a)johnshelbyspong.com or 503-236-3545. Copyright © 2012 ProgressiveChristianity.org, All rights reserved. You are receiving this email because you have a membership at our website. Our mailing address is: ProgressiveChristianity.org 3530 SE Hawthorne Blvd. Unit 1 Portland, OR 97214 Add us to your address book

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Re: [Dialogue] New Email Address
by Jayandem2＠aol.com 13 Oct '12

13 Oct '12

Jean Poole >From Mike Tippett In a message dated 10/11/2012 6:11:55 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, f.knutson(a)verizon.net writes: Jean Who "The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed." ♥ _______________________________________________ Dialogue mailing list Dialogue(a)lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/dialogue-wedgeblade.net

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Bad Email Addresses + Change of Email
by Jack Gilles 12 Oct '12

12 Oct '12

Dear All, The Archive Team is trying to make sure we reach as many people as possible with our news of the advances in the work at the Archives during our Sojourn Program that ends a week from Saturday. We have a mailing list, which we want to expand to as many as possible, that has had a few bounced messages. So we would like those whose mail has bounced to please give us the correct email address so that we can keep our list current. PLEASE DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS EMAIL, SEND THE CORRECTIONS TO EITHER: <steveharrington(a)gmail.com> or <Jackcgilles(a)gmail.com>. Here are those whose email addresses we had that bounced. Adam Thomson Carl Stock David Lazear Doug Druckenmiller Dallas Ziegenhorn Marion & Fred Karpoff Kaze Gadway Mark Welch Linda Vernoy Mimi Shinn Pat Tuecke Bill Schlesinger Rebecca Nichols Rick Deines Sherwood & Eunice Shankland (need both) Jim Stovall Teresa Lingafelter Marie & Richard McGuire Secondly, although I notified my personal mailing list of my email change, I want everyone to have the new address. I will be discontinuing the icabombay address by the end of October. Old address: <icabombay(a)igc.org> New address: <jackcgilles(a)gmail.com>

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From Tippett: Preparation for the 2013 Directory
by Jayandem2＠aol.com 12 Oct '12

12 Oct '12

Dear Colleagues: Yes, it's time again to get the 2013 edition of The Directory pulled together, to mail out in mid-November Please check over your entry in The 2012 Directory. Indicate below any changes necessary. If you don’t have a 2012 Directory and want to see your entry, please email me with your request. For those who aren’t familiar with The Directory, it is a listing of names, addresses, phones and emails and occupations of several hundred people who have been at one time or another associated with the I.C.A., or the Ecumenical Institute, or its programs and projects. If you aren't listed, and want to be, fill out the form below and either mail it to me, or email it. DEADLINE FOR CORRECTIONS IS NOVEMBER 1ST. If you want to order a directory, complete the order form and send your check (made out to Michael B. Tippett). In preparation for the Directory, I need input from you. A. In Memoriam: Please let me know of any colleagues that have died since the last Directory was published. Also, if you know the year of death that isn’t listed for a colleague, let me know. B. Cover for the 2013 Directory: For the past several issues of The Directory, I have featured a picture, a written piece, and/or artwork submitted by colleagues. I would like to hold a contest this year for artwork or a photo to put on the cover. If you have something you would like to submit as a cover possibility, send it to me. The first and second place winners will get a free Directory, and the first place winner will be featured on the cover. It will be interesting to see what the response is. REPLY TO THE DIRECTORY EMAIL ADDRESS, WHICH IS: _movementdir(a)aol.com_ (mailto:movementdir@aol.com) THE DIRECTORY REGISTRATION FOR INDIVIDUALS OR FAMILIES: Please use to update PERSON # 1: Name as it should appear in THE DIRECTORY:________________________________ Date of birth: __________(m/d/y) [optional] Occupation: ____________________________________________________________ (Maximum 45 characters) Office Phone: (__) [____] _______________ Office Fax :(__) [ ___ ] _____________ Bus. E-mail: _________________ (Country Code) [Area or City Code] Local Number PERSON # 2: Name as it should appear in THE DIRECTORY: _______________________________ Date of birth: __________(m/d/y) [optional] Occupation: ____________________________________________________________ (Maximum 45 characters) Office Phone: (__) [____] _______________ Office Fax : (__) [ ___ ]____________ Bus. E-mail: _________________ (Country Code) [Area or City Code] Local Number Home Address: _____________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________ Home Phone: (__) [____] _______________ Home Fax :(__) [ ___ ]_____________ Home E-mail: _________________ (Country Code) [Area or City Code] Local Number Children living with parents: (Include birth dates, also, if desired) ____________________________________________________________________________ _____________ Individual or Family listing is FREE! Cost of the Directory is $20.00 for either the booklet form or a CD copy. If you order 2 forms, it will cost $30.00. **************************************************************************** ******************** ORDER FORM NAME: ______________________________ Email: ________________________ ADDRESS: ____________________________ CITY/STATE/POSTAL(ZIP) CODE/COUNTRY: ____________________________________ Please send me a copy of the directory: [ ] Booklet form [ ] CD Cost of the Directory is $20.00 for either the booklet form or the CD. If you order 2 forms, it will cost $30.00 . The CD will contain In Memoriam and Names and Addresses, etc, in Microsoft Word format. I enclose $___________ (Check/Money Order made out to Michael Tippett) Re: PayPal: I’m sorry, but I can no longer accept PayPal. I’ve had too much trouble with it in the past. Also, I can’t accept Credit Cards. I hope it isn’ t too much of an inconvenience to send a check or money order.. The CD will contain In Memoriam and Names and Addresses, etc, in Microsoft Word format. Send orders to: Michael B. Tippett, 4676 32nd Court East, Bradenton, FL 34203-3946 USA Phone: (941) 753-5189 Email: MOVEMENTDIR(a)aol.com

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Re: [Dialogue] New Email Address
by coevolutionacademy＠juno.com 12 Oct '12

12 Oct '12

Jean Poole Please note: message attached From: Frank Knutson <f.knutson(a)verizon.net> To: ICA-USA <dialogue(a)lists.wedgeblade.net> Subject: Re: [Dialogue] New Email Address Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:11:25 -0700 ____________________________________________________________ Woman is 53 But Looks 25 Mom reveals 1 simple wrinkle trick that has angered doctors... http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/50778789ba23f789619dst01vuc Jean Who "The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger, who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed." ♥

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Re: [Dialogue] New Email Address
by coevolutionacademy＠juno.com 11 Oct '12

11 Oct '12

Thanks Jean! I'll call you soon! Love, Rose Anne ---------- Original Message ---------- From: jeanp246(a)comcast.net To: DPBailey83053(a)aol.com, laura(a)thebaumgartnergang.com, slobberbomber(a)aol.com, kberger(a)speakeasy.net, victoriousocean(a)gmail.com, rbblakn(a)aol.com, TBowen1031(a)aol.com, salschip(a)aol.com, meca(a)fidalgo.net, david.brewster(a)crosscut.com, kdcseak(a)gmail.com, Kdopoi(a)aol.com, MARKDAPASH(a)aol.com, thadmo21(a)yahoo.com, karen6(a)uakron.edu, sharonafisher(a)comcast.net, chrystell.flota(a)gmail.com, Ksewsea(a)speakeasy.net, mollyk01(a)comcast.net, fdmkarpoff(a)gmail.com, fskarpof(a)mailbox.syr.edu, karpoff(a)uw.edu, TimKarpoff(a)aol.com, adrienne.karpov(a)gmail.com, mekarpov(a)gmail.com, rich(a)utemple.org, carolp(a)speakeasy.org, johnp222(a)comcast.net, mpoole(a)prescott.edu, jdtrondsen(a)q.com, lwilkie(a)neo.rr.com, Dialogue(a)wedgeblade.net Cc: jeanpoole34(a)gmail.com Subject: [Dialogue] New Email Address Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2012 15:10:22 +0000 (UTC) Hi Everybody, This is my new email address. Take care, Jean ____________________________________________________________ Fast, Secure, NetZero 4G Mobile Broadband. Try it. http://www.netzero.net/?refcd=NZINTISP0512T4GOUT2

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ICA Accelerate 77 is asking, "What are the dynamics of sustainable communities?"
by Karen Snyder 11 Oct '12

11 Oct '12

> As university students were interviewed to participate in the Accelerate 77 Summer Program, each was asked, "What does sustainability mean to you?" Consistently they responded that sustainability included economic, social and environmental dynamics. These three dynamics are taught in universities. > > We learned from various websites how others look at sustainable communities such as: > * Ecotrust's image under "What does a sustainable society look like?" at www.conservationeconomy.net > * An ecovillage image of "The 15 elements of ecovillage living" at http://www.gaia.org/mediafiles/gaia/resources/HJackson_whatIsEv.pdf > * Transition movement's image of "Transition to a Resilient Future" at www.transtionus.org (US) or www.transitionnetwork.org (global) > > Our intent was to integrate the language from these websites, ICA's community development program chart, and our experience. Paul Noah has created the beautiful design below to hold the current thinking. > > This is a DRAFT. In the midst of the energy focused on the Accelerate 77 Share Fair September 15th, there has been little time to develop and refine this work. We are now posting it on the listserve in order to occasion a broader conversation and feedback to create a design for sharing with sustainable communities in the future. > > Enjoy! And send your feedback!! >

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New Email Address
by jeanp246＠comcast.net 11 Oct '12

11 Oct '12

Hi Everybody, This is my new email address. Take care, Jean

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the new ICA
by Terry Bergdall 09 Oct '12

09 Oct '12

The subject line, "the old Order passing away," has been grabbing my attention for several days now as I open my email. While that is certainly a statement of fact in regard to our EI/OE/ICA community, it is far from being the whole story. During the past academic year, September-May 2012, ICA-USA had 200+ university students engaged in preparation field work for the city-wide share fair, "Accelerate 77." Then, for ten weeks during the summer, we were rocked daily with 40 interns passionately "bending history" as they completed the work. Their presence has been living proof of our 50th Anniversary slogan, "Midway in a Century of Care." The following link will give you a glimpse at what I'm talking about. You'll see Seva Gandhi, a full-time staff person of ICA-USA and a current member of the ICA-International Board of Directors, and Dylan Amlin, one of the summer interns, being interviewed about the "Sharing Approaches That Work" event on September 15: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNtJle4YfH0&feature=bf_prev&list=UUdS0glKdGe… All is good, all is received, that past is approved, the future is open. Take care, Terry

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Fwd: The ICA meet(pic attached)
by Jack Gilles 08 Oct '12

08 Oct '12

Dear All, Thought you would enjoy seeing the picture of the ICA 50th event in India. What a great group of colleagues. Vinod Parekh is the one with the black hat in the back. Peace, Jack Begin forwarded message: > From: Vinod Parekh <vinodparekh(a)gmail.com> > Date: October 4, 2012 1:24:50 AM CDT > To: Jack Gilles <icabombay(a)igc.org> > Subject: The ICA meet(pic attached) > >

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