- Dialogue - lists.wedgeblade.net

Fwd: Goodbye Nelson Mandela
by Gail West 08 Dec '13

08 Dec '13

I'm always grateful to hear how our colleagues have chosen to make a difference in this world. Every vote in the US Congress is important! Gail ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Paul Clements <Clements4Congress(a)gmail.com> Dear friends, In 1978 I was 17 and a freshman at Harvard. At a student meeting I learned that the government in South Africa made black South Africans live in “bantustans” – secluded wastelands – and carry passes to come to the cities and suburbs to work as maids or gardeners. Hundreds of protesters had been shot down in the Sharpeville massacre, Steve Biko had been killed in police custody, and Nelson Mandela was in prison on Robben Island. But the Harvard endowment was growing from profits made in South Africa, benefiting from the racist state. To do what I could I joined our campus’s Southern Africa Solidarity Committee, and helped to organize teach outs and demonstrations calling for divestiture. A great university should not profit from racist oppression. On Mandela’s passing, I want to honor and appreciate his leadership not only in ending apartheid, but in accomplishing the near-impossible, a largely peaceful transition to a democratic, inclusive, multi-racial South Africa. I’m grateful to have made my small contribution. Harvard’s divestiture movement was one of the first in the country, and divestiture is a cause I’m proud to have shared with Congressman Howard Wolpe and two-time 6thDistrict congressional candidate Don Cooney. On Mandela’s passing, let’s remember that racism remains a blight on American society. The preponderance of young black men in America’s prisons represent a failure of our society. In recent years we also see rising inequality, poverty, and hunger throughout our country, while 90% of the gains from America’s economic growth have been going to the top 1%. Can you help me to carry the struggle for social justice to Congress? December 31st, the next Federal Election Commission campaign finance filing deadline, is crucial. The following deadline is the end of March, and by then the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and most of the national organizations will have chosen the races they will support in 2014. To gain the national support my campaign needs in order to win, my fourth quarter finance report needs to show grassroots support continuing to build; I need to raise another $30,000 by the end of the year. Can you contribute $10, $50, $100 or $500? Please give whatever you can at: https://secure.actblue.com/contribute/page/clements2win<http://images.myngp.com/LinkTracker.aspx?crypt=IVi0ax2%2b6UDLpC3olJXC4yrvlL…> Thank you! Paul Clements Campaign contributions can also be made at ClementsforCongress.com<http://images.myngp.com/LinkTracker.aspx?crypt=IVi0ax2%2b6UBSinc%2fCPYaKcY%…>or mailed to "Committee to Elect Paul Clements" 2517 Broadway Ave., Kalamazoo, MI 49008. Paid for by Committee to Elect Paul Clements Clements for Congress 2517 Broadway Avenue Kalamazoo, MI 49008 [image: Forward this message to a friend]<http://images.myngp.com/LinkTracker.aspx?crypt=IVi0ax2%2b6UDLpC3olJXC457kkj…> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, click here<http://images.myngp.com/LinkTracker.aspx?crypt=IVi0ax2%2b6UBSinc%2fCPYaKYRb…> Powered by NGP VAN, Inc.<http://images.myngp.com/LinkTracker.aspx?crypt=IVi0ax2%2b6UBSinc%2fCPYaKdzn…> -- *Gail West, ICA* *3F, No. 12, Lane 5, Tien Mou W RdTaipei, Taiwan 111Ph) 8862) 2871-3150* email) icataiw(a)gmail.com Skype) gwestica www.icatw.com

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Mandela quote...
by Ellie Stock 07 Dec '13

07 Dec '13

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Celebrating the completed life of Nelson at 95
by steve har 05 Dec '13

05 Dec '13

-- Steve Harrington

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12/05/13, Spong: America's Health Care Debate and What it Reveals
by Ellie Stock 05 Dec '13

05 Dec '13

HOMEPAGE MY PROFILE ESSAY ARCHIVE MESSAGE BOARDS CALENDAR America's Health Care Debate and What it Reveals Every nation I visited on my recent European lecture tour has a National Health System, paid for by tax dollars and run for all the people by the government itself. Contrary to the propaganda of the American political right, these health services are well run and enormously popular in both conservative and liberal circles. The citizens in these democracies assume that health care is a right, guaranteed by the state to all. It is not a perk of the workplace, available only to those who are employed. It is an asset of citizenship. So Europe’s leaders and its citizens across the political spectrum viewed the recent American episode in political brinkmanship, which attempted to defund the Affordable Care Act, as the act of an adolescent America, demonstrating yet again that its leaders are not mature enough to govern the world’s most powerful nation. Sometimes it is salutary to see our nation through the eyes of others. To them America’s Tea Party leaders were refusing to address the social problems that plagued Europe in the 19th century, problems made quite vivid by the novels of Charles Dickens! The idea that a few of the Congressional majority would actually force America into default and bankruptcy, bringing on, the Europeans feared, a world wide depression in order to stop people from getting health care, left them disillusioned with America’s political leadership. I share that anger and view with alarm not only the behavior of the Tea Party leaders, but also that of the moderate wing of the Republican Party for not standing up to the bullying, almost neo-Nazi like tactics, of these right wing extremists. Have we as a nation really come to the place where one of our two major political parties is willing to let the poor, who have no insurance, die because they can’t afford treatment? Are we now so individualistic as a nation that we will refuse to act out any sense of corporate responsibility toward the less fortunate of this land? Are we willing to say that people who have pre-existing medical conditions cannot buy health insurance? Have we come to the place where we act as if medical care is only the privilege of the wealthy? The stated propaganda, recycled through every right wing politician, that the United States has the best health care in the world is challenged by the facts. It also reveals how little privileged politicians know about the real world of America’s poor. There is not one single category in which U.S. health care is statistically the best in the world when the entire population is averaged in! What we do have is the most expensive health care in the world, but America’s patients get less bang for their buck than in any other developed nation. Too many people feed at the trough of the American practice of medicine. The drug companies sell drugs to every other country of the world at a lower rate than they sell them in America. Trial lawyers, who live off suing doctors and hospitals, also add to the costs of our system of health care. Medical equipment builders and suppliers want independent hospitals to compete for their state of the art devices, even though they reach a saturation point in urban areas and once they are purchased, the doctors are encouraged to use them whether competent care calls for that test or not. The medical profession itself has become for many doctors not a vocation in which they serve, but a position that can and does make them quite wealthy. Is an income of over a million dollars a year necessary for some doctors to provide good health care? I am not anti-doctor. I know quite well the high cost of a medical education and the years of very low salaries as an intern or a resident, but should there be no limit on how much profit anyone can make on the sicknesses of our fellow citizens? Should paying dividends to shareholders or massive salaries to executives of Health Care Companies be a necessary or even a moral component in delivering health care to the masses of our citizens? The same Congress who tried to defund the Affordable Care Act has also refused to consider increasing taxes on those whose ordinary income exceeds a million dollars a year; they have refused to cap insurance settlements awarded by juries in malpractice cases; they have balked at closing loopholes, which make it possible for the secretaries of doctors to pay a higher percentage of their incomes in taxes than do the doctors, and they have made no effort to reign in the excessive profits of the health care corporations or the medical device businesses. There is something ethically wrong when the political passion is to provide tax cover for wealthy people while at the same time trying to gut the health care of ordinary Americans. It is scary as well. I listened in vain to the Tea Party congressmen, to Senator Ted Cruz of Texas and to those who supported their efforts to hear what alternative they had to offer, if they actually had succeeded in defunding and thus killing the Affordable Care Act. The fact is that they have no alternative to offer and when pressed on this glaring omission, they fall back on slogans like “self insurance” that have long ago failed, leaving some 40 million United States citizens, most of them women and children, without insurance and thus without significant health care. When we clear away the political rhetoric and propaganda, there are only three alternatives for providing health care to the citizens of this country. One is to create a National Health Care System that includes every one and is funded by tax dollars and run by the government. This is the system adopted by every developed nation in the world except the United States. Critics marshal their arguments against this system which, when examined and tested by experience, are blatantly not true. “No government can run anything competently,” they say. Yet Medicare is a government run health care program that patients and doctors alike applaud. “You will have no choice in how you are treated or by whom,” is another incorrect fear-mongering attack. The fact is that the insurance companies dictate to us the doctors who are in their system that we are allowed to see. “Death panels will be set up and life or death decisions will be made by bureaucrats.” That was the Sarah Palin line. It is also blatantly untrue and it is little more than fear being peddled by people with a vested interest to protect. There comes a time when life and death decisions must be made. A “Living Will” is one way to do that and the choice to do so is always in the hands of the patient. If we could get past our fears, there are many advantages to a national health care system. Its focus is on health maintenance and prevention, not on treating the disease once contracted. There is a tremendous saving in a single payer plan. For many in the United States, however, such a plan smacks of “socialized medicine” and even though that response is both irrational and uninformed, it is nonetheless powerful. That is why in the United States alone, some method that will provide universal health care through private corporations has been cobbled together. To do it this way is enormously complicated, which then allows its critics to castigate it for the red tape and complicated decision-making by bureaucrats rather than by doctors. If medical care is to be run as a free enterprise, profit-making system, the health corporations will of necessity be forced to control costs. The free market is designed to insure profit to share holders. So you can’t have it both ways. The Affordable Care Act passed in the first two years of the Obama administration was in fact patterned on a plan developed by the Heritage Foundation, a conservative Republican think tank. Its original purpose was to counter any attempt to build a national health care service. It was adopted first by the state of Massachusetts under the leadership of Republican Governor Mitt Romney. In order to work, it requires universal enrollment or a fine paid by those who do not enroll. Everyone, including the young and healthy, must be in the system to keep costs down. If young people can opt out of the system it will simply collapse financially. The trade off is that people pay when they are young to be able to afford health care when they are old. To mitigate against the price shock to the young, a provision was added to the law to enable young people to stay on their parent’s heath care plan until age 26, if they were still living at home either unemployed or working on a graduate degree. It also requires that exotic health care practices be regulated. An enormous percentage of every health care dollar is spent in the last year of a person’s life. Decisions will have to be made as to when we are prolonging life and when we are simply postponing death. That fact of life, faced everyday in every hospital in this land, is what politicians use to spread fear of death panels and “allowing Grandma to die.” A mature society must be willing to define the moment when meaningful life comes to an end. If there is no universal national health care system then this privately run, for profit, health care bill is the only alternative. The Affordable Care Act represents this alternative. The Tea Party wing of the Republican Party would not tolerate a national health program and now apparently they are not willing to tolerate a privately run health care program either. They want to defund this “disaster” before it can get established. Fair enough, we say, then what is your alternative? They have none! They propose none! So what does that mean? It means that they desire that health care be available only to those who can afford it! That is the inevitable result if this part of the Republican Party has its way. Health care thus becomes an asset that only the well-to-do can enjoy. The rest will depend on charity, the good will of a few doctors or the beneficence of a patron. Those who want to defund the Affordable Care Act surely must know that this is their only alternative. Can the Affordable Health Care Act be improved? Of course, but that will have to be accomplished through the legislative process. The bulldozer tactics of the Tea Party will never accomplish reform. So this nation’s choice is either to make the Affordable Care Act work or to embrace the only cruel alternative that remains. I am sick of ideologically-driven politicians who do not know or admit the consequences of their own outrageous rhetoric. ~John Shelby Spong Read the essay online here. Question & Answer Alice Smith of Chattanooga, Tennessee, writes: Question: Your columns are always thought provoking and filled with such wisdom. Thanks for sharing your incredible knowledge and insight with us. I was thrilled when you came to Chattanooga several years ago and I actually got to hear you in person at Grace Church. A recent column reminded me of one you wrote last summer right before my granddaughter was to be baptized. In last summer’s column you wrote about performing a baptism and being struck with the language used in the baptismal service. I have been a member of the Church of the Good Shepherd in Chattanooga for over 40 years, but I have to admit I was a little surprised when my son, who lives with his wife and daughter in California, said he wanted to have his daughter baptized here in the church where he grew up. Although he is a very spiritual person, he hasn’t attended church for years. I myself rarely attend services at our church because when hearing the liturgy and reciting the creeds, I feel as if I am being forced to wear shoes that I have outgrown and that feel several sizes too small. I am eternally grateful, however, that the church allows our dream group to meet there and encourages our “sacred studies” group to hold weekend workshops there as well. I have thanked our priest on more than one occasion for being open to letting me and the others explore our spirituality in unconventional ways. Back to my granddaughter’s baptism. We couldn’t have the service in the church because there are only certain Sundays used for joint baptisms and their visit didn’t fall on one of those Sundays. We decided to have the service at a family cabin on a lake in the woods and a friend of mine, who is an Episcopal priest, but has no parish, agreed to perform the baptism. When she sent the service to my son to read, he said he didn’t like it because there was way too much talk about sin. It was right about this time that your column came out so I sent it to him. He agreed with everything you said! My priest friend then sent him the Australian service which she thought might be more to his liking. The mention of sin in this version was a turn off as well. He said all they wanted to do was to introduce their daughter to God’s love. The priest was bound by her vows to use some form of Episcopal liturgy so my son went online and found a pastor in Chattanooga from the Unity Church who was thrilled over performing the service. It was his first baptism and he wrote the service himself. It was absolutely glorious! You have opened up a monumentally important topic in that column and closed with the question, “What can we do about it?” I await your response with an open mind and eager anticipation. Answer: Dear Alice, First, may I say that I am delighted you found the Unity Church. That group of Christians seems to me to be moving in the path that the church of the future must move and I applaud them. I think they are leading in the direction that more mainline churches will inevitably go in the future. Traditional religious concepts, however, die slowly and sometimes only after exhausting themselves in denial and irrelevance. The major problem with most baptism liturgies, including those of my own church, is that they were developed as the cure for a diagnosis that is simply wrong. They assume the pre-modern mythology that there was in the beginning an original perfection of which originally perfect human beings were a part. That is portrayed biblically in the story of the perfection in the mythical Garden of Eden. According to this biblical story, however, that perfection was broken by human disobedience, which in turn plunged human beings and the whole world into original sin. That is portrayed in the biblical story of the fall and subsequent banishment of the first human family from the Garden of Eden. It was this story that formed the original theological framework in which baptism has been cast. It postulates an originally perfect creation, which was ruined by original sin. Apart from the cleansing waters of baptism, life is doomed to be lived apart from God. That is why the church once taught that unbaptized babies suffered in hell for all eternity. That idea was so repugnant that in time it was modified and “Limbo for unbaptized children” was developed. This Limbo was not a place of eternal punishment, but it was a place where its inhabitants were forever denied the vision of God’s presence. This theology turns God into a monster who does not know how to forgive. The primary desire of this God is to punish unless this God can rescue. This theology turns Jesus into the ultimate victim of God’s wrath. Jesus had to pay the price that God required for our sins. It turns you and me into guilt-filled victims. The good news, however, is that this theology is based on presuppositions that are being dismissed increasingly because they are simply wrong. There was no original perfection. There was rather a long and complicated evolution from matter, to life, to consciousness, to self-consciousness. If there was no original perfection, there could have been no fall from perfection, so original sin is simply wrong and it has got to go. If there was no fall into sin, then seeing Jesus as the savior who rescues us from the fall that never happened, to restore us to a status that we have never possessed, becomes absolute nonsense. We must develop a new way to tell the Christ story. Human life is not fallen, it is incomplete. We do not need a savior, we need the love and affirmation that accepts us as we are and empowers us to be all that we are capable of being. Your son’s comment that all he wanted to do was to introduce his daughter to the love of God is dead accurate. That is what baptism is supposed to be about. I did a baptism several weeks ago in my church in Morristown and before I began, I tried to defang the baptismal liturgy. We still have a long way to go. I encourage clergy in all traditions to work on the theology and liturgy of baptism. Until those liturgies are changed, I urge parents to get past the words of most baptismal liturgies until you find the words “Bring them to the fullness of God’s peace and glory.” That is what baptism is all about. ~John Shelby Spong Announcements We are small, but we have huge hearts and huge ideas! Can you help us during this season of giving? We would love to continue to create curriculum that is meaningful, spiritual, and intelligent for all ages! We would love to continue to gather the best, most relevant, and inspiring liturgy for your faith community! We would love to create children's books that are spiritual and powerful for all those sweet little beings out there! We would love to create more book study guides, un-church church models, intentional community models, and interfaith awareness.... We would love to do all this and more! But we can't do it without your support. We are a small non-profit and we rely solely on donations from people like you. Please donate today so we can continue to provide all the spiritual resources that you and your loved ones can enjoy and learn from. Can you help? If you would like to see us continue to create truly progressive, compassionate, and intelligent curriculum for all ages as well as liturgies and adult curriculum for evolving faith communities, please donate today. Thank you for your consideration, ProgressiveChristianity.org, your publishers .

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Fwd: WHOLE BK CVR 2nd book
by Sarah H. Buss 05 Dec '13

05 Dec '13

Colleagues, To simplify distribution, my second book of poetry Love Letters to a Mirage in the Desert, Is available only at Book People 603 North Lamar Austin, TX 78703 512/472-5050 1/800/853-9757 $12.95. 124 pages First 30 copies purchased are signed. If you want to let me know that you have purchased one email me at shb.poetry(a)gmail.com I did not make Thanksgiving , but it is still in time for Christmas . Enjoy Sarah Sent from my iPad Begin forwarded message: > From: Rebecca Arthur <re.byrdb(a)gmail.com> > Date: November 13, 2013 at 2:08:32 PM CST > To: Sarah Buss <sbuss(a)austin.rr.com> > Cc: "Sherrell, Terry" <terry.sherrell(a)1touchpoint.com> > Subject: WHOLE BK CVR > > > >

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Global Buzz
by ICA International 01 Dec '13

01 Dec '13

Enjoy catching up with what is happening in ICAs across the globe.....If you wish to SEND a report...send to your ICA contact person OR...go to the members section on the ICA International website CHECK to ensure Dates under are Correct Please click the link below for the December issue of the Global Buzz Global Buzz Report: 2013 12 01 or copy and paste this URL into your browser's address bar http://ica-international.org/buzz/7dayreport-13/2013-12-01.php ICAI Communications

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"Journey Reflection" Novemberr 2013 Top-viewed Blogs
by Lynda Cock 30 Nov '13

30 Nov '13

Dear colleagues, Following are the top-viewed blog posts during November <blocked::http://rejourney.blogspot.com/2013/11/journey-reflection-blog-revi ew-november.html> 2013. As always, thank you for your quote suggestions, comments, and forwarding blog posts (even this e-mail). Happy Thanksgiving weekend, Lynda and John >Blog: "Journey Reflection" at 4 links ... Google: <http://www.rejourney.blogspot.com/> www.reJourney.blogspot.com Google Plus: <https://plus.google.com/u/0/114307312715975337692/posts> Journey Reflection/Google Plus Facebook: <https://www.facebook.com/transcribebooks> https://www.facebook.com/transcribebooks Twitter: <https://twitter.com/transcribebooks> https://twitter.com/transcribebooks >Web Page: <http://www.transcribebooks.com/> www.transcribebooks.com >Books: <https://www.amazon.com/author/johnpcock> https://www.amazon.com/author/johnpcock

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11/28/13, Spong: A Thirty-Day Lecture Tour of Europe
by Ellie Stock 28 Nov '13

28 Nov '13

HOMEPAGE MY PROFILE ESSAY ARCHIVE MESSAGE BOARDS CALENDAR A Thirty-Day Lecture Tour of Europe It was probably the most exciting and fulfilling book tour of my entire career. Over a period of thirty days, I journeyed through Europe delivering sixteen public lectures in Spain, Italy, England and Scotland. We also touched Switzerland and Wales. In Wales we spent the night and met with Peter Francis, the warden of the Gladstone Library in Hawarden. This is where an event called the John A. T. Robinson-John Shelby Spong Lectureship on “Frontier Theology” had just concluded its third annual weekend conference. It was, said the Warden, a sold out success. Bishop Gene Robinson had been its leader. The public print media across the continent seemed to express great interest in the content of this lecture tour, as we had national coverage in Spain and Italy and local coverage in many additional places. Radio also seemed interested and we did one thirty-minute Spanish radio interview on a nationwide station. Probably the highlight of the media’s attention was a back page feature with a three column picture in “El Mundo,” Spain’s largest and most respected daily newspaper, under the headline: “El Obispo de los Gays,” or “The Bishop for the Gays!” The interest of the European media in our presence was piqued primarily by two things: First, I was a bishop, a title that still commands respect, especially in Spain and Italy, but this bishop was addressing biblical and theological themes not from the point of view of traditional assumptions and official church teaching, but from the point of view of contemporary biblical and theological scholarship. Critical biblical teaching simply has not yet permeated either of these two countries, so it was all quite new to them. Second, I was a bishop who was quite up front in my support of gay rights and same sex marriage. Those ideas are well established in Italy and especially in Spain, where same sex marriage has been legal for some time, but in both countries, its supportive voices have been from the secular, not the religious world and certainly not from a recognized religious leader. No bishop in either Spain or Italy has addressed either of these subjects publicly. Even the presence of my wife, Christine, in both countries created curiosity. “The Bishop’s Wife” is not a known category in the vocabulary of either Spain or Italy! We had discovered this last year in Spain when I held a press conference to respond to questions from a number of reporters. When this press conference was over, I stepped down from the stage and rather routinely kissed my wife. I do that frequently and it did not occur to me that this act might be startling to anyone. The stories in the Spanish papers the next day, however, were headlined “Bishop Kisses Wife.” A day later that was a story in the papers across Latin America! Since there are no bishops with wives there, a bishop kissing a wife was unique. In both Spain and Italy, the Roman Catholic Church is the only Christian expression of any significance known in the land. So if people abandon Roman Catholicism, as indeed many of them have, they have also abandoned Christianity in particular and organized religion in general. Both Spain and Italy would be classified today as secular societies, but secular societies with an overlay of obvious Catholic history, culture and symbols. If people in both countries are asked what their religion is, they will almost universally claim a Catholic identity, but that identity does not express itself in attending church services. One Spanish Catholic priest in Madrid told me, “No one attends Mass today but a few old women.” I gave two of my lectures in Spain at the University of Madrid and one of my lectures in Italy at the University of Bergamo. Both of these settings were memorable. In the course of my career, I have lectured at over 400 universities, colleges and theological schools around the world, but never have I been so warmly and so effusively welcomed by a university and its faculty as I was in Madrid. The lectures there were translated for me by the professor of Slavic languages on the faculty of the university and attended by a number of faculty and administrative leaders. An elegant luncheon, held in our honor, concluded the day. Dessert at that luncheon consisted of a slice of Spanish melon, which may have been the most delicious piece of fruit I have ever tasted. At this university, I had the pleasure of having private conversations with some of the professors. The sense that I received from them was that Spain was living in a time of deep spiritual hunger and that there is no sense that this hunger could or ever would be addressed by the Catholic Church as presently constituted. That institutional, religious system, as currently practiced in Spain, is not a viable option for them for a number of reasons. First, the Roman Catholic Church is still closely identified with the Franco dictatorship, which this Church backed, along with most of Spain’s wealthy families and all of Spain’s right wing politicians. Second, the Catholic Church of Spain expresses constant negativity toward modern knowledge in general and scientific knowledge in particular. Third, this church is associated primarily with hostility toward the aspirations of women and with negativity toward birth control, family planning and abortion under all circumstances. Finally, this church still exhibits a tremendous, almost visceral, negativity towards homosexual people. What this means is that the Catholic Church in Spain is simply endured, not welcomed, in the secular society of that nation. One of the faculty members said to me that the University of Madrid simply would not think of inviting a Catholic bishop to lecture there. When I asked why, he responded, “We do not think any of them have anything to say that we want to hear.” I wonder if the hierarchy of this church has any idea about how irrelevant the church has become in this land where they have always dominated religiously. That reality, however, does not change the fact that if Christianity is to be revived in Spain, it must be revived by the Catholic Church! There is no alternative. It is quite impossible to start a new ecclesiastical structure here. For the Catholic Church to move in a new direction would require the support of at least one bishop and a large body of priests. It would have to have the hierarchy’s toleration, if not its blessing, As long as this Church persecutes and removes its most creative thinkers, as surely has happened under the papacies of John Paul II and Benedict XVI, no bishop or priest will dare to step into the role of theological leadership. I do not believe that such a revival of interest in Christianity in Spain is likely, though it is obvious to me that present everywhere is a deep spiritual hunger for a faith that is relevant, open and willing to engage the world in a new way. The address I gave at the University of Bergamo in Italy followed the usual European academic model. The visiting lecturer is advertised publicly and anyone who wishes to speak in opposition to the visiting lecturer is invited to sign up to do so. My announced topic was “The Doctrine of God: Why Theism is no Longer a Viable Option for 21st Century Believers.” Five people signed up to counter my presentation. Two hours were allotted for this debate. My translator was a young woman who taught high school English. I was to speak for about fifty minutes. Those scholars who had signed up to speak in opposition were to speak in order and to be limited to twenty minutes each. No one seemed to recognize that a lecture or response, which had to be translated, inevitably took longer. I was to be given a chance to respond to each presenter as soon as he had completed his remarks. My lecture, with translation, lasted an hour and twenty minutes. The first responder also went well beyond his assigned limit of twenty minutes. Something had to give. Since this format of challenging an established thinker is the way young scholars build their national reputations, it was decided that none of the prepared responses could be eliminated. This was, after all, their opportunity to take on a visiting American, so they eliminated instead my responses to each of them. It was an interesting tactic. Almost all of those who had asked to speak were religious conservatives. The visiting American had obviously rattled the cages of the hierarchy. So I heard an Italian defense of the depravity of human nature. I heard about the necessity of defining God as a being, clearly understood in supernatural theistic terms. I heard about the necessity for this deity not only to judge, but also to determine truth. I heard traditional church doctrines, such as original sin, atonement, incarnation and the Holy Trinity, being defended in classical 13th century forms. I heard the claim that Christianity alone is the one “true faith” and that prayer served to bring the God above the sky into direct contact with the problems of the world, both personal and cultural. Responding individually would have been impossible anyway since these responders and I did not share the same presuppositions and the examination of our basic theological assumptions would not have been possible in the time allotted. After I had absorbed the torrent of words from these young scholars for over two hours, I responded very briefly that I did not come to Italy to convert anyone, but only to start a conversation about why Christianity was dying in Italy and about what a new Christian future might look like in that land. Clearly I had been successful in doing that and I was quite content with that achievement. There were other events on this trip that cannot be chronicled here. I shall return to these in subsequent columns. I now simply file the fact that this lecture tour validated my personal experience that underneath the deadness of traditional church life in Europe, there is still a passion, an interest and an excitement about how Christianity might look if it were able to be separated from traditional forms of church life. I found in both Spain and Italy secular societies that are not anti-God, but anti antiquated understandings of God. I found a readiness to move on justice issues for women and homosexual persons. I returned excited about the future, yes, even in lands once regarded as lost to the Christian Church forever. ~John Shelby Spong Read the essay online here. Question & Answer Jackie and Bruce Davey from Medina, Ohio, write: Question: It was a pleasure to hear and meet you at Trinity Cathedral in Cleveland last November. We always enjoy your talks and books. It is exciting and such a relief to hear from a biblical scholar that the thoughts we have mulled over for many years – about God and the life of Jesus and what it all means for the world – are not totally crazy – or subversive! A small but growing study group, meeting in our home, enjoys discussing your books among others. So – thank you for sharing your knowledge! We know it has not been an easy road for you. The question: Is there a “Progressive Christianity” study Bible available that would help us search Scripture and give historical background? Answer: Dear Jackie and Bruce, ProgressiveChristianity.org the organization that publishes my weekly column has begun the task of providing Church School material for children. They also monitor other resources that might be available for use in congregations. You might want to check in with them. There is, however, no such thing as a “Progressive Christianity Study Bible.” Only fundamentalists, who are not progressive Christians, think that way. The Bible is a collection of 66 books (plus the Apocrypha) written over a period of about 1,000 years, between approximately 2,000-3,000 years ago, by a wide variety of different authors living under a wide variety of differing historical circumstances. No single volume could embrace that diversity. My 2011 book, Re-Claiming the Bible for a Non-Religious World was written to provide a single sweeping source to introduce the various books of the Bible to a study audience. That book will come as close to what you are seeking as I could recommend. I have just learned that Harper/Collins has now issued this book in paperback, which will make it more available and less expensive as a resource for group study. I have also been both amazed and pleased to discover how many small churches across the United States, where resources and money are in short supply, use this weekly column and/or the Question and Answer feature as the basis for their adult class every Sunday morning. The discussions engendered, I’m told, are quite energizing. I think single book discussion groups are an incredible way to bring new ideas to a local congregation. So, I commend these few ideas to you. My best, John Shelby Spong Announcements Bishop Spong and his wife Christine, as well as the publishers, ProgressiveChristianity.org, offer our sincere gratitude to our subscribers! Thank you for your support and your interest. May this thanksgiving season be full of love, laughter and delight! THANK YOU!

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Fwd: Journey to the East Chart
by steve har 27 Nov '13

27 Nov '13

For Bill Salmon and others "headed east" If you click this link you will see a google document with images for HH, the book cover and the original chart from the Odyssey construct from 1969. This is the link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Jr3jeqkmwJy3OZV0EW5ZKb-wxA-5KxjoyMM94eK… The chart was found a a recent Archives Sojourn. Jack did a collegium and found a passage where HH woke-up from his isolation and reconnected to the League via the Archives. It made everyone there grin when he read. We were talking about the 50/50 year view that you can have -maybe should have when hanging around archives: 50 years from the past, 50 years for the future. The challenge is to find and express the future of our past. Point made I remember well was: "nostalgia isn't what it used to be" and the "archives are about finding the future of our shared past". I believe Wendell Refior is creating an Archive Collection that will be available online. Maybe the Journey to the East conversations should be available on-line. I expect he would welcome help, suggestions and some contributions to the collection if you have some to share. Send Marge Philbrook thanksgiving wishes, she's found things in the Archives you and I have forgotten, and should be available to emerging generations in the 21st C for whom the 20th C is "mythical dreamtime". -- Steve Harrington

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Realistic Living's 60th journal in 30 years!
by Ken Fisher 26 Nov '13

26 Nov '13

Colleagues, On behalf of the 500+ subscribers and myself, heartiest congratulations and gratitude to Gene, Joyce and Alan for the production and delivery of the 60th issue of the RL Journal on Ethics and Religion. Since leaving the Order Ecumenical thirty years ago, this journal, also thirty years old, has ever been my guide for spiritual grounding. Ken "An issue of Realistic Living is like the breath of the Holy Spirit on paper." Richard Clarke, Salem, Indiana Realistic Living: A Journal on Ethics and Religion is published twice a year, July and November, and mailed to over 500 friends and contributors. Each 16-20 page 8 1/2" X 11" issue contains reflections, essays, book reviews, movie reviews, and sometimes poetry on current ethical issues and on topics of Christian resurgence, including dialogue with other religious expressions. With this journal we are attempting to fill a gap in religious and ethical publishing—more secular than the religious press, more religious than the secular press. We are concerned to illuminate time-tested wisdoms in contemporary metaphors and stories. Our November 2013 journal will be our sixtieth issue. http://www.realisticliving.org/index.htm

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