[Dialogue] The Grand Design

Tue May 22 07:55:54 PDT 2012

I suppose the only thing that could get us in deeper doo doo as a species than the current rancorous controversies would be if we were to all, suddenly, come to some grand conclusion about things . . .

There is an Italian from Nicaragua in the living room practicing on Judy's piano . . .

Jim Wiegel

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--- On Mon, 5/21/12, PSchrijnen at aol.com <PSchrijnen at aol.com> wrote:

From: PSchrijnen at aol.com <PSchrijnen at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] The Grand Design
To: dialogue at lists.wedgeblade.net
Date: Monday, May 21, 2012, 10:11 PM

Indeed John, 

You say that well. I think that was the point of the debate: To point out 
that these two academics operate in two parallel universes. Dawkins was 
surprisingly open and charming. he is usually more righteous. In this 
debate he behaved. The surroundings of the Sheldonian may have helped.

Williams is retiring at the end of the year to become the master of a 
Cambridge college. He is a fine theologian, and has played a positive role as 
archbishop in civil life here. I am sure he will be glad to get out of that 
job though. I have enjoyed his book Silence and Honey Cakes frequently. A fine 
little book about the wisdom of the desert monastics. 

Paul

In a message dated 21/05/2012 22:52:36 GMT Daylight Time, 
jlepps at pc.jaring.my writes:
Thanks 
  Paul for this fascinating dialogue. It was far more civil than some of the 
  exchanges of ideas that often occur on this side of the Atlantic. 

IMHO, Dr. Dawkins was quite modest in his claims to certainty about 
  things, and Archbishop Williams was quite articulate in defining what he did 
  and did not mean by "God." It seemed, though, that Dr. Dawkins was objecting 
  to a notion of God that Archbishop Rowan did not advocate, and that is an 
  example of what I find objectionable about Steven Hawking's book. Of course it 
  would be silly to expect physicists to be experts in theology, as it would be 
  for theologians to claim expertise in physics. The two can co-exist quite 
  harmoniously with one dealing with value and meaning (why) and the other 
  dealing with the nature of reality and its operations (what and how). 

John 

At 12:40 PM 5/20/2012, you wrote:

  I enjoyed the debate 
    between Richard Dawkins and Rowan Williams on some of these questions:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfQk4NfW7g0

Maybe 
    it adds another 
    dimension...?

Paul

In 
    a message dated 20/05/2012 19:18:12 GMT Daylight Time, LAURELCG at aol.com 
    writes:

      Jack,

      The Ground of Being that WAS before the big bang, and the Evolutionary 
      Impulse (Becoming) that started the big bang, is what we've called God. 
      (This I've gleaned from Andrew Cohen.) I agree it is all intelligent, but 
      our tiny brains cannot begin to understand it. IT is the All, in the 
      phrases, "All that is, is good." and "I am One with All That Is." Science 
      is about grappling to understand it. Good scientists are usually in awe of 
      what they're discovering. What else would keep someone looking in a 
      microscope all day every day for years, or whatever laborious process is 
      required in their discipline? Scientists like Bryan Swimme and men of 
      faith like Thomas Berry sometimes collaborate to come up with inspired 
      works, like The Universe Story. This is all just my humble 
      opinion, as is the belief that the church, the cutting edge today, is the 
      evolutionary spirituality movement. Jean Houston is a recognized leader of 
      it and almost invariably ends her internet sessions with "These are the 
      times, we are the people."

      From the great central valley of California, the center of the 
      Universe,

      Jann  

      In a message dated 5/20/2012 10:57:34 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, 
      icabombay at igc.org writes:

        As to the "Grand Design", it is the contention of some that the 
        creative process, that which underlies all, is inherently intelligent 
        and that intelligence can be understood.

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