[Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney

Tue Sep 18 19:44:26 PDT 2012

Herman, I understand your point and understand how you come to it.  And I
appreciate your taking the time to continue the dialogue in a useful way.

There was a defining moment in 2008 when we elected our first African
American President, and despite my concerns about his lack of experience and
socialist leanings (and therefore my very reluctant  vote for his opponent,
whom I did not hold in high regard), I awoke the next morning with a feeling
of delight that we had finally broken the race barrier (even if we have yet
to break the gender barrier) to the highest office in the land, arguably in
the world.

Four years later I am deeply disappointed in President Obama and even more
deeply concerned that our country will never recover from his mismanagement.
I fear that this country will soon be so impoverished and debt ridden that
we will no longer be in a position to help any other country dig out from
under dictatorship and economic hopelessness.

Neither party and no candidate is ever going to be perfect, or completely
moral, or above reproach.  But the rhetoric the past few election cycles has
been beyond the pale.  And I am so weary of the name calling and the
propagation of wild stories and wilder interpretations—on both sides.  I am
sick unto death of all of it.

Susan

From: oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net
[mailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 5:55 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney

Okay, Susan,

What I am suggesting is that there is a turning point happening away from
the Reagan years and perhaps away from the politics you favor. Just keep
September 17 in mind and see if that is true. 

There are values on both sides. Essentially the messages of the two
conventions were “we are all in this together” and the other “be
self-reliant and keep government small.” The latter point is valid, but it
hides the fact that neither side has done that, entitlements grew enormously
under Republican Presidents, more so under Bush than Obama. Even when Obama
proposes savings, which you would expect Republicans to favor, they are
distorted as destroying, in this example, Medicare. 

No, I don’t mean what you mean by defining moment. I mean that what has come
out on this video exposes a deep problem and one that people will turn away
from.  “We’re all in this together and be self-reliant and keep government
small” are not really oppositional. But keep government small has to be
taken in a certain way, because neither side is proposing a small
government.

I guess what I am saying is that I think that September 17 ended a certain
period in American political history. Both sides will have to adjust to it.

Herman

  _____  

From: oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net
[mailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Susan Fertig
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 5:12 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney

Oh, I heartily agree that it is a turning point/defining moment, etc.  Just
that I think the current President is destroying the country, so I’m coming
from a different perspective than yours.

Susan

From: oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net
[mailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:33 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney

I didn’t assume that everyone on the list was a Democrat. 

There are those moments in history that are defining moments. I could be
wrong Susan, but I think this is one of them. It is kind of the end of an
era and so I sent the email as one commenatator’s (not my) statement of what
has become evident. Take it for what it’s worth, but consider that this is a
turning point in American politics and that the debate (the one that will
never end) will now be carried out on a different basis.

I didn’t send the message as a Democratic commentary, but as news.

Herman

  _____  

From: oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net
[mailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net]
<mailto:%5bmailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net%5d>  On Behalf Of Susan
Fertig
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:21 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney

First, I find it offensive that there is an assumption that everyone on the
listserv is a Democrat or espouses that party’s platform.  Look up the
definition of “group think”.

Second, I find it offensive to perpetuate negatively distorted
characterizations of one candidate (and I’ve often found that this listserv
also perpetuates characterizations of others that are just as distorted
through bias on perceived positives).  That’s the Kool-aid part.

And yes, the Kool-aid analogy could be attributed to all of us, myself
included, who participated fanatically in something called the Spirit
Movement that came pretty close to being a cult.  You’re right. 

Susan

From: oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net
[mailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net]
<mailto:%5bmailto:oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net%5d>  On Behalf Of David
Walters
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:05 PM
To: Order Ecumenical Community
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney

Susan 

You need to explain what our collegue Herman has said that has offended you.

As one who is retired, pay no federal income tax, plus in two months from
today I will qualify for Medicare - I am proud to say that I am part of the
47% that Romney spewed so much contempt for in the video referenced in
Herman's comment. 

I didn't know that Herman was in the Kool-Aid business, although if Joe M
athews was with us and still teaching RS-1, he certainly would be accused of
such.

-David Walters

Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid,
and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that
succeeds it.

Susan

 <http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/18/the_real_romney.html> The
Real Romney

<http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/real-romney-is-a-sneering-plutocrat.ht
ml> Jonathan Chait says the
<http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/17/romney_explains_obama_voters.h
tml> hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a
far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering
plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the
heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market
incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from
seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of
an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief,
Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..." 

"The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never
hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run
for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry
through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines,
he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor,
sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's
embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and
moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class." 

_____________________________________________ 

Herman Greene 

2516 Winningham Drive 

Chapel Hill, NC 27516 

919-929-4116 (h) 

919-624-0579 (c) 

919-942-4358 (f) 

Skype: hgreene-nc 

hfgreene at mindspring.com 

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