[Dialogue] Guernica & Conversation Roots & Shoots

Thu May 3 16:46:44 PDT 2012

Bully conversation --

This is one place I find our listservs serve us well.  I watch for the 
next header to pop up with another thoughtful contribution to the thread.

I can't get into this one without it triggering old memories and 
stories.  Those of us who have used and taught our methods over the 
years have probably not only seen most of their possible bungled 
applications--we've probably made most of them ourselves.  There are so 
many aspects to leading or facilitating any of these that we pretty 
quickly learn none of them can be reduced to just a set of steps or 
procedures which, once learned, assure future success.  Trust the 
method, to be sure; then mix in all those learnings about yourself, 
those you work with and life itself that really make that method work.

I still have vivid memories of the first time I was assigned to lead the 
conversation method in a live RS-1.   It was with a large group in Room 
A, West Side, latter 60s, and I'd been given the Freedom Conversation 
("Who'd be willing to take George to the airport?").  Amazingly to me, 
it wasn't going nearly as well as I recalled it had in my own RS-1.  As 
I was struggling to stay afloat, Slicker edged in to help redirect 
things so that the group could genuinely wrestle with the issues being 
raised.  I felt like a flaming failure--then came to treasure it as one 
of my great learning moments.

A story that bears on what we've been talking about is of Joe's take on 
the conversation method.  It was in a pedagogy guild; he was leading it, 
and we were on the movie conversation.  I recall one of the staff asking 
him something like, "Joe, how do we make sure in this conversation that 
people /get it/ about Miss Miller?"

Joe's response was abrupt and unequivocal: "That's not your job!  You're 
not out here to _teach_ anyone anything.  Teaching happens in the 
seminars, not in the conversations.  Your job, what this conversation 
method does, is to see that people seriously confront the life questions 
that this movie raises. /That /they authentically confront them is your 
concern;/what/ they decide about them is not."

He paused, then added: "Now, if six months or six years later, someone 
who was in this conversation should be sitting on the crapper--and all 
of sudden--jump up and shout, 'MISS MILLER WAS A SHITASS!'--well, that 
would be great.  But that's not your job, not the job of the 
conversation, to make that happen."

Joe had his ways to make his points stick with you.

When I teach the Focused Conversation method or ORID these days, I tell 
people that it can be--often is--used in teaching; and that it can 
be--indeed, often is--used to help a group reach some level of agreement 
or consensus; but that its real job is to help the group to have the 
serious conversation it needs to have.

Gordon

On 5/3/2012 2:55 PM, Wilson Priscilla wrote:
> You can read about a wide variety of leadership roles and skills in 
> /The Facilitative Way. /The premise of the book is that everyone in 
> the "group" is called to be a leader...assume responsibility for what 
> is happening.
>
> I happen to recommend the book...which is now available again after 
> being out of print for a year.
> Anyone interested can let me know and I'll give you a Discount code to 
> purchase it for $6.95.
>
> I'm enjoying all the variety of methods conversations...
> Priscilla Wilson
>
> On May 3, 2012, at 4:43 PM, steve har wrote:
>
>> To my taste nurturing roots and growing new shoots is actually a
>> timely task in the face of a 50 year vision.
>>
>> Nurturing roots and shoots for ways of leading in complex situations
>> is a good thing.
>>
>> Debating the reliability of ORID with facilitators is like listening
>> to a group of carpenters argue about whether hammers put nails in
>> boards.
>>
>> Studying Brian's new version of Chapter 10 would be delightful,
>> especially online with generous hearts and open inquiry
>>
>> What new shoots for 50 years?
>>
>> Building a house with only a carpenter and a hammer seems silly.
>> Plumbers and Roofers would be good.
>>
>> Bending history with only a facilitator role and an ORID conversation
>> seems daunting as well.
>>
>> I'm thinking more roles, conversations and tools are needed:
>> Facilitators facilitate knowing
>> Pedagogues and Story-Makers grant being
>> Navigators, Coaches, Mentors cause  action outcomes
>>
>> Mathews's NRM and Jenkins's 9D book don't only belong to facilitators.
>> Might be a good point of departure for some new thinking.
>>
>> Did you read Kaze Gadway's post this morning? She's hard at work in
>> the Being-Doing mode. She is mentoring those indian kids on behalf of
>> the next generation. She's granting new being side by side with those
>> kids. There is no facilitation in sight.
>>
>> Not everyone needs to think, be, do it al, all the time either. Seems
>> like it is a time for more appreciative inquiry and more innovations
>> not less.
>>
>> --re presuppositions--
>>
>> The assertion that ORID is THE way the mind thinks doesn't pass the
>> "no-smiling allowed" test in Buddhist circles. It would be a topic for
>> generous respectful inquiry, maybe a testable hypothesis.
>>
>> Heidegger asserted that most people don't actually know much about
>> hammering, especially carpenters,  they are just being in the world
>> hammering. Not too much reflection goes on until the hammer hits the
>> thumb for most carpenters. Kind of sets those Cartesian abstractionist
>> back a step or two.
>>
>> Carpenters have skillful means they don't need to do an ORID they just
>> have the experience of hammering skillfully. Some people focus on
>> knowing, some on doing, some on doing.
>>
>> I assert that the world needs more leadership roles, and facilitators
>> have great skill set. It isn't the only leadership skill set.
>>
>> Mathews had a fine insight when he separated out the phenomena of
>> knowing being and doing. What new leadership roles and conversations
>> and skillful means?
>>
>> What happens when you take up a practice like facilitating, teaching,
>> coaching, mentoring, story-making skill sets? You practice being
>> skillful until you get it right and you get it automatic.
>> See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreyfus_model_of_skill_acquisition
>>
>> If you plot leadership roles on Mathews's NRM triangle as updated by
>> the Jenkins it might look like this
>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1DlNTut28MXqLnv-_Xd2yPoHONBHlOAJLC8AmwL_O2B8/edit
>>
>> Seems like some new skill sets might evolve too.
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Steve
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>>
>
> Priscilla H Wilson
> Pris at TeamTechPress.com <mailto:Pris at TeamTechPress.com>
> 913-432-2107
> www.teamtechpress.com <http://www.teamtechpress.com>
>
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