[Dialogue] Grand Design

[steve har]

Jack

I went to the zen center last night with your "provocative
proposition" in the arena of scientific distinctions vs having a
getalt, perhaps a mostly christian gestalt that holds heaven and earth
more or less in the same unifying framework. [my take on your view,
might not be your take on your view]

The words I carried with me from your last dialogue post were:

..."You (John Epps) are very kind to Dawkins with your last statement
"The two can co-exist......" because, although there is a general
acceptance of evolution by most theologians (but not necessarily to
the degree of mindlessness that Dawkins advocates), their side
(Dawkins) does not recognize the other side at all.  All of the wonder
and mystery will some day be understood as simply brain signals that
trigger these feelings etc. etc.  So the whole "game" is played on the
left brain rules of the game; logic, science and language.
I'm not going to again make the case for an intelligence implicit in
all things, but the ability to have a purpose to all this requires
some direction, some purpose behind all the science activity.  The
capacity to integrate experience and thus evolve into better survival
capacity requires intelligence. Jack."

For those not acquainted with Soto zen...
the ceremonial & study group I attended is a tradition of a 100 days
study group that became a because of the rainy season hundreds of
years ago which continues today.

There wasn't much for the monks to do except get out of the rain and
gather together and among other tasks study something. The usual
routine is
-listen for the signal of the  "Han" -a wooden hammer striking a
wooden announcement board inscribed with "the important matter of life
and death
-silent siting meditation
-a 1on1 short private, sometimes public conversation between teacher
and student often around a
-a study of some text in sort of a bible study mode or maybe a
literary seminar group at a college.

I was startled to hear Dosho Port -the seminar leader" take up a 1300
Century paragraph for Dogen who was the founder of Soto Zen and the
1st person to write holy literature in Japanese instead of Chinese;
sort of like Luther publishing 99 paragraphs in German instead of
Latin [the real blasphemy'

The paragraph from Dogen was YOUR theme: "Even if there is a
hair-breath of difference, you ar as far away as heaven from earth.
This being so, the ultimate way is not difficult, it is just that
selection is necessary" [talking about Awareness/Enlightenment]

The Rochester Zen Center took up this paragraph which is often treated
as a zen koan and with poetry like:  "Zin Zin Ming" -- often
translated as Faith or Affirming Faith in Mind [written by one of the
oldest Chinese Buddhist teachers a kind of Joe Mathews character]

The Poem talks about the advantages/disadvantages of having
distinctions or having a unified view and reads in part:

The Great Way is not difficult for those who do not pick and choose.
When preferences are cast aside, the Way stands clear and undisguised.
But even slight distinctions made set earth and heaven far apart.
If you would clearly see the truth, discard opinions pro and con.
To founder in dislike and like is nothing but the mind’s disease.
And not to see the Way’s deep truth disturbs the mind’s essential peace.

You can read the whole thing at:
http://www.rzc.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/RZC-chant-book-cropped.pdf

The Rochester Zen Center has spent some years trying to get the
Chinese and Japanese into suitable English so it can be made into a
proper Soto-style chant, which is a little like learning how write and
perform current hip-hop. You can hear the Rochester Zen Center
changing this poem here:
http://www.rzc.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Affirming-Faith-in-Mind.mp3

What's my point:
1. Dawkin's view may be a little scientific provincial, like his
christian debaters are a little christian provincial.
It is a big world out there.

There are a lot of people trying to find what it means to try to find
a space to stand in that hyphenated space between This world -- The
other world.

2 And it is the reason I like your provocative propositions...and also
-Joe Mathews talk on the Other World about 1972
-John Epps 1996+ work on Other World in contemporary language not the
coded  jargon of 1972  Other World Charts
-the Jenkins translations of the New Religious Mode Chartes into 21C language.




--
Steve Harrington