We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery.I know that one's hard to beat!But it gets worse! Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory.But here's what's worse: Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote.Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives.The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal.This raises what is for me a burning question: why would any woman vote for Trump?And especially any woman who could conceive?Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second any other woman is personally under threat?As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack?I just don't get it.So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if every white male voted for Donald Trump, he would have to lose if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right?Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing.So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why any female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous.I think it comes down to this: a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles. This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships.In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience.In my humble opinion!So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution?Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage. The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system.I invite your responses.And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote! Marshall Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook: P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
Hi W.J and other colleagues I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome". My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call. However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light. Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery. I know that one's hard to beat! But it gets worse! Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory. But here's what's worse: Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote. Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives. The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal. This raises what is for me a burning question: why would any woman vote for Trump? And especially any woman who could conceive? Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second any other woman is personally under threat? As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack? I just don't get it. So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if every white male voted for Donald Trump, he would have to lose if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right? Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing. So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why any female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous. I think it comes down to this: a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles. This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships. In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience. In my humble opinion! So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution? Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage. The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system. I invite your responses. And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote!
Marshall
Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook:
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>
P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes. Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge. Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others… My two cents. Bill Schlesinger From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> On Behalf Of Mari Crocker via OE Sent: Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre Hi W.J and other colleagues I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome". My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call. However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light. Marilyn On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> > wrote: We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery. I know that one's hard to beat! But it gets worse! Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory. But here's what's worse: Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote. Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives. The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal. This raises what is for me a burning question: why would any woman vote for Trump? And especially any woman who could conceive? Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second any other woman is personally under threat? As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack? I just don't get it. So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if every white male voted for Donald Trump, he would have to lose if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right? Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing. So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why any female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous. I think it comes down to this: a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles. This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships. In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience. In my humble opinion! So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution? Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage. The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system. I invite your responses. And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote! Marshall Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook: <457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg> P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants. <457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you
Amen! Dear friend, Bill. Thank you for this, and many other insightful comments you have shared over the years. Fond memories of the time Joe and I spent with your family, way back, when you were discerning your call. Fondly, Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 7:22 PM, <w.schlesinger@pvida.net> <w.schlesinger@pvida.net> wrote:
The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes.
Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge.
Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others…
My two cents.
Bill Schlesinger
From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net>> On Behalf Of Mari Crocker via OE Sent: Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> Cc: Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com <mailto:maricrocker@gmail.com>> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Hi W.J and other colleagues
I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome".
My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call.
However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light.
Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote:
We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery. I know that one's hard to beat! But it gets worse! Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory. But here's what's worse: Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote. Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives. The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal. This raises what is for me a burning question: why would any woman vote for Trump? And especially any woman who could conceive? Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second any other woman is personally under threat? As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack? I just don't get it. So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if every white male voted for Donald Trump, he would have to lose if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right? Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing. So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why any female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous. I think it comes down to this: a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles. This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships. In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience. In my humble opinion! So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution? Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage. The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system. I invite your responses. And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote!
Marshall
Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook:
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>
P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you
It’s hard to respond point by point to demonstrably false statements and charges. COVID was so much more destructive than it needed to have been – largely due to Trump’s refusal to deal with the science and politicizing responses. The resistance to immunizations, use of masking (common in other parts of the world) – well, you get the point. Illusory claims of ‘greatness’ are just that. We may see a Trump victory. And we need to be prepared to stay at the center, to understand that the order of things in the systems will continue to be a process of persons seeking to create a ‘visionary dream’ – to quote Bonhoeffer – and persons seeking to do what it caring and responsible. And this is true whether or not we see a Trump victory. We’ll have to work in that world as we do now, with an understanding that we will not conquer by destroying an enemy but by being who we are called to be. Personally, we’ve contributed, voted, and spoken as clearly as we can in the networks and relationships we have. But our ‘heroes’ aren’t the ones who overthrew a tyranny. Our ‘heroes’ are those who cared and sustained even while marginalized and attacked. ‘Lest Innocent Blood be Shed’ is an account of a village that sheltered Jews in France – and did so while being gentle with the Vichy forces. That led to warnings before raids as even those in the Vichy regime chose to care. Again, FWIW. Bill From: James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com> Sent: Monday, October 28, 2024 8:35 PM To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: w.schlesinger@pvida.net; Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre Watching the world series, I am hit by ads similar to the post forwarded by Susan — 3 1/2 years in office and things didn’t get done and now they will —I dont know how to respond to that … help Jim Wiegel “…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“. The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:00 PM, Mari Crocker via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> > wrote: Amen! Dear friend, Bill. Thank you for this, and many other insightful comments you have shared over the years. Fond memories of the time Joe and I spent with your family, way back, when you were discerning your call. Fondly, Marilyn On Oct 28, 2024, at 7:22 PM, <w.schlesinger@pvida.net <mailto:w.schlesinger@pvida.net> > <w.schlesinger@pvida.net <mailto:w.schlesinger@pvida.net> > wrote: The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes. Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge. Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others… My two cents. Bill Schlesinger From: OE < <mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> On Behalf Of Mari Crocker via OE Sent: Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM To: Order Ecumenical Community < <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Mari Crocker < <mailto:maricrocker@gmail.com> maricrocker@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre Hi W.J and other colleagues I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome". My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call. However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light. Marilyn On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE < <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery. I know that one's hard to beat! But it gets worse! Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory. But here's what's worse: Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote. Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives. The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal. This raises what is for me a burning question: why would any woman vote for Trump? And especially any woman who could conceive? Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second any other woman is personally under threat? As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack? I just don't get it. So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if every white male voted for Donald Trump, he would have to lose if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right? Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing. So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why any female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous. I think it comes down to this: a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles. This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships. In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience. In my humble opinion! So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution? Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage. The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system. I invite your responses. And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote! Marshall Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook: <457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg> P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants. <457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <https://www.google.com/url?q=http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net&source=gmail-imap&ust=1730774139000000&usg=AOvVaw0YbbLh1LlRexTn9X0qMwDL> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. 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October 27, 2024 (Sunday) I stand corrected. I thought this year’s October surprise was the reality that Trump’s mental state had slipped so badly he could not campaign in any coherent way. It turns out that the 2024 October surprise was the Trump campaign’s fascist rally at Madison Square Garden, a rally so extreme that Republicans running for office have been denouncing it all over social media tonight. There was never any question that this rally was going to be anything but an attempt to inflame Trump’s base. The plan for a rally at Madison Square Garden itself deliberately evoked its predecessor: a Nazi rally at the old Madison Square Garden on February 20, 1939. About 18,000 people showed up for that “true Americanism” event, held on a stage that featured a huge portrait of George Washington in his Continental Army uniform flanked by swastikas. Like that earlier event, Trump’s rally was supposed to demonstrate power and inspire his base to violence. Apparently in anticipation of the Sunday rally, Trump on the previous Friday night replaced his signature blue suit and red tie with the black and gold of the neofascist Proud Boys. That extremist group was central to the January 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol and has been rebuilding to support Trump again in 2024. On Saturday the Trump campaign then released a list of 29 people set to be on the stage at the rally. Notably, the list was all MAGA Republicans, including vice presidential nominee Ohio senator J.D. Vance, House speaker Mike Johnson (LA), Representative Elise Stefanik (NY), Representative Byron Donalds (FL), Trump backer Elon Musk, Trump ally Rudy Giuliani, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., right-wing host Tucker Carlson, Trump sons Don Jr. and Eric, and Eric’s wife, Republican National Committee co-chair Lara Trump. Libbey Dean of NewsNation noted that none of the seven Republicans running in New York’s competitive House races were on the list. When asked why not, according to Dean, Trump senior advisor Jason Miller said: “The demand, the request for people to speak, is quite extensive.” Asked if the campaign had turned down anyone who asked to speak, Miller said no. Meanwhile, the decision of the owners of the Los Angeles Times and the Washington Post not to endorse Democratic presidential candidate Vice President Kamala Harris seems to have sparked a backlash. As Will Bunch of the Philadelphia Inquirer noted, “in a strange way the papers did perform a public service: showing American voters what life under a dictator would feel like.” Early on October 26, the Washington Post itself went after Trump backer billionaire Elon Musk with a major story highlighting the information that Musk, an immigrant from South Africa, had worked illegally when he started his career in the U.S. Musk “did not have the legal right to work” in the U.S. when he started his first successful company. As part of the Trump campaign, Musk has emphasized his opposition to undocumented immigrants. The New York Times has tended to downplay Trump’s outrageous statements, but on Saturday it ran a round-up of Trump’s threats in the center of the front page, above the fold. It noted that Trump has vowed to expand presidential power, prosecute his political opponents, and crack down on immigration with mass deportations and detention camps. It went on to list his determination to undermine the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), use the U.S. military against Mexican drug cartels “in potential violation of international law,” and use federal troops against U.S. citizens. It added that he plans to “upend trade” with sweeping new tariffs that will raise consumer prices, and to rein in regulatory agencies. “To help achieve these and other goals,” the paper concluded, “his advisers are vetting lawyers seen as more likely to embrace aggressive legal theories about the scope of his power.” On Sunday the front page of the New York Times opinion section read, in giant capital letters: “DONALD TRUMP/ SAYS HE WILL PROSECUTE HIS ENEMIES/ ORDER MASS DEPORTATIONS/ USE SOLDIERS AGAINST CITIZENS/ ABANDON ALLIES/ PLAY POLITICS WITH DISASTERS/ BELIEVE HIM.” And then, inside the section, the paper provided the receipts: Trump’s own words outlining his fascist plans. “BELIEVE HIM,” the paper said. On CNN’s State of the Union this morning, host Jake Tapper refused to permit Trump’s running mate, Ohio senator J.D. Vance, to gaslight viewers. Vance angrily denied that Trump has repeatedly called for using the U.S. military against Americans, but Tapper came with receipts that proved the very things Vance denied. Trump’s rally at Madison Square Garden began in the early afternoon. The hateful performances of the early participants set the tone for the rally. Early on, comedian Tony Hinchcliffe, who goes by Kill Tony, delivered a steamingly racist set. He said, for example: “There’s literally a floating island of garbage in the middle of the ocean right now. I think it’s called Puerto Rico.” He went on: “And these Latinos, they love making babies too. Just know that. They do. They do. There’s no pulling out. They don’t do that. They come inside. Just like they did to our country.” Hinchcliffe also talked about Black people carving watermelons instead of pumpkins. The speakers who followed Hinchcliffe called Vice President Kamala Harris “the Antichrist” and “the devil.” They called former secretary of state Hillary Clinton “a sick son of a b*tch,” and they railed against “f*cking illegals.” They insulted Latinos generally, Black Americans, Palestinians and Jews. Trump advisor Stephen Miller’s claim that “America is for Americans and Americans only” directly echoed the statement of Adolf Hitler that "Germany is for Germans and Germans only.” Trump took the stage about two hours late, prompting people to stream toward the exits before he finished speaking. He hit his usual highlights, notably undermining Vance’s argument from earlier in the day by saying that, indeed, he believes fellow Americans are “the enemy within.” But Trump perhaps gave away the game with his inflammatory language and with an aside, seemingly aimed at House speaker Johnson. “I think with our little secret we are gonna do really well with the House, right? Our little secret is having a big impact, he and I have a secret, we will tell you what it is when the race is over,” Trump said. It seems possible—probable, even—that Trump was alluding to putting in play the plan his people tried in 2020. That plan was to create enough chaos over the certification of electoral votes in the states to throw the election into the House of Representatives. There, each state delegation gets a single vote, so if the Republicans have control of more states than the Democrats, Trump could pull out a victory even if he had dramatically lost the popular vote. Since he has made virtually no effort to win votes in 2024, this seems his likely plan. But to do that, he needs at least a plausibly close election, or at least to convince his supporters that the election has been stolen from him. Tonight’s rally badly hurt that plan. As Hinchcliffe was talking about Puerto Rico as a floating island of garbage, Democratic presidential nominee Vice President Kamala Harris was at a Puerto Rican restaurant in Philadelphia talking about her plan to spread her opportunity economy to Puerto Rico. She has called for strengthening Puerto Rico’s energy grid and making it easier to get permits to build there. After the “floating island of garbage” comment, Puerto Rican superstar musician Bad Bunny, who has more than 45 million followers on Instagram, posted Harris’s plan for Puerto Rico, and his spokesperson said he is endorsing Harris. Puerto Rican singer and actor Ricky Martin shared a clip from Hinchcliffe’s set with his 16 million followers. His caption read: “This is what they think of us.” Singer and actress Jennifer Lopez, who has 250 million Instagram followers, posted Harris’s plan. Later, singer-songwriter and actress Ariana Grande posted that she had voted for Harris. Grande has 376 million followers on Instagram. Singer Luis Fonsi, who has 16 million followers, also called out the “constant hate.” The headlines were brutal. “MAGA speakers unleash ugly rhetoric at Trump's MSG rally,” read Axios. Politico wrote: “Trump’s New York homecoming sparks backlash over racist and vulgar remarks.” “Racist Remarks and Insults Mark Trump’s Madison Square Garden Rally,” the New York Times announced. “Speakers at Trump rally make racist comments, hurl insults,” read CNN. But the biggest sign of the damage the rally did was the frantic backpedaling from Republicans in tight elections, who distanced themselves as fast as they could from the insults against Puerto Ricans, especially. The Trump campaign itself tried to distance itself from the “floating island of garbage” quotation, only to be met with comments pointing out that Hinchcliffe’s set had been vetted and uploaded to the teleprompters. As the clips spread like wildfire, political writer Charlotte Clymer pointed out that almost 6 million Puerto Ricans live in the states—about a million in Florida, half a million in Pennsylvania, 100,000 in Georgia, 100,000 in Michigan, 100,000 in North Carolina, 45,000 in Arizona, and 40,000 in Nevada—and that over half of them voted in 2020. In 1939, as about 18,000 American Nazis rallied inside Madison Square Garden, newspapers reported that a crowd of about 100,000 anti-Nazis gathered outside to protest. It took 1,700 police officers, the largest number of officers ever before detailed for a single event, to hold them back from storming the venue. On Tue, Oct 29, 2024, 6:42 AM Bill Schlesinger via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
It’s hard to respond point by point to demonstrably false statements and charges. COVID was so much more destructive than it needed to have been – largely due to Trump’s refusal to deal with the science and politicizing responses. The resistance to immunizations, use of masking (common in other parts of the world) – well, you get the point. Illusory claims of ‘greatness’ are just that.
We may see a Trump victory. And we need to be prepared to stay at the center, to understand that the order of things in the systems will continue to be a process of persons seeking to create a ‘visionary dream’ – to quote Bonhoeffer – and persons seeking to do what it caring and responsible. And this is true whether or not we see a Trump victory. We’ll have to work in that world as we do now, with an understanding that we will not conquer by destroying an enemy but by being who we are called to be.
Personally, we’ve contributed, voted, and spoken as clearly as we can in the networks and relationships we have. But our ‘heroes’ aren’t the ones who overthrew a tyranny. Our ‘heroes’ are those who cared and sustained even while marginalized and attacked. ‘Lest Innocent Blood be Shed’ is an account of a village that sheltered Jews in France – and did so while being gentle with the Vichy forces. That led to warnings before raids as even those in the Vichy regime chose to care.
Again, FWIW.
Bill
*From:* James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com> *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 8:35 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* w.schlesinger@pvida.net; Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Watching the world series, I am hit by ads similar to the post forwarded by Susan — 3 1/2 years in office and things didn’t get done and now they will —I dont know how to respond to that … help
Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:00 PM, Mari Crocker via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Amen! Dear friend, Bill. Thank you for this, and many other insightful comments you have shared over the years. Fond memories of the time Joe and I spent with your family, way back, when you were discerning your call. Fondly, Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 7:22 PM, <w.schlesinger@pvida.net> < w.schlesinger@pvida.net> wrote:
The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes.
Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge.
Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others…
My two cents.
Bill Schlesinger
*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Mari Crocker via OE *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Hi W.J and other colleagues
I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome".
My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call.
However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light.
Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery.
I know that one's hard to beat!
But it gets worse!
Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory.
But here's what's worse:
Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote.
Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives.
The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal.
This raises what is for me a burning question: why would *any woman* vote for Trump?
And especially any woman who could conceive?
Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second *any other woman* is personally under threat?
As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack?
I just don't get it.
So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if *every* white male voted for Donald Trump, he would *have to lose* if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right?
Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing.
So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why *any* female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous.
I think it comes down to this: *a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles.*
This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships.
In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience.
In my humble opinion!
So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution?
Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage.
The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system.
I invite your responses.
And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote!
Marshall
Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook:
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>
P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
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Thanks Judi, from Heather Cox Richardson’s column. She keeps me halfway sane these days! Nancy On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 8:49 AM Judi White via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
October 27, 2024 (Sunday)
I stand corrected. I thought this year’s October surprise was the reality that Trump’s mental state had slipped so badly he could not campaign in any coherent way.
It turns out that the 2024 October surprise was the Trump campaign’s fascist rally at Madison Square Garden, a rally so extreme that Republicans running for office have been denouncing it all over social media tonight.
There was never any question that this rally was going to be anything but an attempt to inflame Trump’s base. The plan for a rally at Madison Square Garden itself deliberately evoked its predecessor: a Nazi rally at the old Madison Square Garden on February 20, 1939. About 18,000 people showed up for that “true Americanism” event, held on a stage that featured a huge portrait of George Washington in his Continental Army uniform flanked by swastikas.
Like that earlier event, Trump’s rally was supposed to demonstrate power and inspire his base to violence.
Apparently in anticipation of the Sunday rally, Trump on the previous Friday night replaced his signature blue suit and red tie with the black and gold of the neofascist Proud Boys. That extremist group was central to the January 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol and has been rebuilding to support Trump again in 2024.
On Saturday the Trump campaign then released a list of 29 people set to be on the stage at the rally. Notably, the list was all MAGA Republicans, including vice presidential nominee Ohio senator J.D. Vance, House speaker Mike Johnson (LA), Representative Elise Stefanik (NY), Representative Byron Donalds (FL), Trump backer Elon Musk, Trump ally Rudy Giuliani, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., right-wing host Tucker Carlson, Trump sons Don Jr. and Eric, and Eric’s wife, Republican National Committee co-chair Lara Trump.
Libbey Dean of NewsNation noted that none of the seven Republicans running in New York’s competitive House races were on the list. When asked why not, according to Dean, Trump senior advisor Jason Miller said: “The demand, the request for people to speak, is quite extensive.” Asked if the campaign had turned down anyone who asked to speak, Miller said no.
Meanwhile, the decision of the owners of the Los Angeles Times and the Washington Post not to endorse Democratic presidential candidate Vice President Kamala Harris seems to have sparked a backlash. As Will Bunch of the Philadelphia Inquirer noted, “in a strange way the papers did perform a public service: showing American voters what life under a dictator would feel like.”
Early on October 26, the Washington Post itself went after Trump backer billionaire Elon Musk with a major story highlighting the information that Musk, an immigrant from South Africa, had worked illegally when he started his career in the U.S. Musk “did not have the legal right to work” in the U.S. when he started his first successful company. As part of the Trump campaign, Musk has emphasized his opposition to undocumented immigrants.
The New York Times has tended to downplay Trump’s outrageous statements, but on Saturday it ran a round-up of Trump’s threats in the center of the front page, above the fold. It noted that Trump has vowed to expand presidential power, prosecute his political opponents, and crack down on immigration with mass deportations and detention camps. It went on to list his determination to undermine the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), use the U.S. military against Mexican drug cartels “in potential violation of international law,” and use federal troops against U.S. citizens. It added that he plans to “upend trade” with sweeping new tariffs that will raise consumer prices, and to rein in regulatory agencies.
“To help achieve these and other goals,” the paper concluded, “his advisers are vetting lawyers seen as more likely to embrace aggressive legal theories about the scope of his power.”
On Sunday the front page of the New York Times opinion section read, in giant capital letters: “DONALD TRUMP/ SAYS HE WILL PROSECUTE HIS ENEMIES/ ORDER MASS DEPORTATIONS/ USE SOLDIERS AGAINST CITIZENS/ ABANDON ALLIES/ PLAY POLITICS WITH DISASTERS/ BELIEVE HIM.” And then, inside the section, the paper provided the receipts: Trump’s own words outlining his fascist plans. “BELIEVE HIM,” the paper said.
On CNN’s State of the Union this morning, host Jake Tapper refused to permit Trump’s running mate, Ohio senator J.D. Vance, to gaslight viewers. Vance angrily denied that Trump has repeatedly called for using the U.S. military against Americans, but Tapper came with receipts that proved the very things Vance denied.
Trump’s rally at Madison Square Garden began in the early afternoon. The hateful performances of the early participants set the tone for the rally. Early on, comedian Tony Hinchcliffe, who goes by Kill Tony, delivered a steamingly racist set. He said, for example: “There’s literally a floating island of garbage in the middle of the ocean right now. I think it’s called Puerto Rico.” He went on: “And these Latinos, they love making babies too. Just know that. They do. They do. There’s no pulling out. They don’t do that. They come inside. Just like they did to our country.” Hinchcliffe also talked about Black people carving watermelons instead of pumpkins.
The speakers who followed Hinchcliffe called Vice President Kamala Harris “the Antichrist” and “the devil.” They called former secretary of state Hillary Clinton “a sick son of a b*tch,” and they railed against “f*cking illegals.” They insulted Latinos generally, Black Americans, Palestinians and Jews. Trump advisor Stephen Miller’s claim that “America is for Americans and Americans only” directly echoed the statement of Adolf Hitler that "Germany is for Germans and Germans only.”
Trump took the stage about two hours late, prompting people to stream toward the exits before he finished speaking. He hit his usual highlights, notably undermining Vance’s argument from earlier in the day by saying that, indeed, he believes fellow Americans are “the enemy within.”
But Trump perhaps gave away the game with his inflammatory language and with an aside, seemingly aimed at House speaker Johnson. “I think with our little secret we are gonna do really well with the House, right? Our little secret is having a big impact, he and I have a secret, we will tell you what it is when the race is over,” Trump said.
It seems possible—probable, even—that Trump was alluding to putting in play the plan his people tried in 2020. That plan was to create enough chaos over the certification of electoral votes in the states to throw the election into the House of Representatives. There, each state delegation gets a single vote, so if the Republicans have control of more states than the Democrats, Trump could pull out a victory even if he had dramatically lost the popular vote.
Since he has made virtually no effort to win votes in 2024, this seems his likely plan.
But to do that, he needs at least a plausibly close election, or at least to convince his supporters that the election has been stolen from him. Tonight’s rally badly hurt that plan.
As Hinchcliffe was talking about Puerto Rico as a floating island of garbage, Democratic presidential nominee Vice President Kamala Harris was at a Puerto Rican restaurant in Philadelphia talking about her plan to spread her opportunity economy to Puerto Rico. She has called for strengthening Puerto Rico’s energy grid and making it easier to get permits to build there.
After the “floating island of garbage” comment, Puerto Rican superstar musician Bad Bunny, who has more than 45 million followers on Instagram, posted Harris’s plan for Puerto Rico, and his spokesperson said he is endorsing Harris.
Puerto Rican singer and actor Ricky Martin shared a clip from Hinchcliffe’s set with his 16 million followers. His caption read: “This is what they think of us.” Singer and actress Jennifer Lopez, who has 250 million Instagram followers, posted Harris’s plan. Later, singer-songwriter and actress Ariana Grande posted that she had voted for Harris. Grande has 376 million followers on Instagram. Singer Luis Fonsi, who has 16 million followers, also called out the “constant hate.”
The headlines were brutal. “MAGA speakers unleash ugly rhetoric at Trump's MSG rally,” read Axios. Politico wrote: “Trump’s New York homecoming sparks backlash over racist and vulgar remarks.” “Racist Remarks and Insults Mark Trump’s Madison Square Garden Rally,” the New York Times announced. “Speakers at Trump rally make racist comments, hurl insults,” read CNN.
But the biggest sign of the damage the rally did was the frantic backpedaling from Republicans in tight elections, who distanced themselves as fast as they could from the insults against Puerto Ricans, especially. The Trump campaign itself tried to distance itself from the “floating island of garbage” quotation, only to be met with comments pointing out that Hinchcliffe’s set had been vetted and uploaded to the teleprompters.
As the clips spread like wildfire, political writer Charlotte Clymer pointed out that almost 6 million Puerto Ricans live in the states—about a million in Florida, half a million in Pennsylvania, 100,000 in Georgia, 100,000 in Michigan, 100,000 in North Carolina, 45,000 in Arizona, and 40,000 in Nevada—and that over half of them voted in 2020.
In 1939, as about 18,000 American Nazis rallied inside Madison Square Garden, newspapers reported that a crowd of about 100,000 anti-Nazis gathered outside to protest. It took 1,700 police officers, the largest number of officers ever before detailed for a single event, to hold them back from storming the venue.
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024, 6:42 AM Bill Schlesinger via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
It’s hard to respond point by point to demonstrably false statements and charges. COVID was so much more destructive than it needed to have been – largely due to Trump’s refusal to deal with the science and politicizing responses. The resistance to immunizations, use of masking (common in other parts of the world) – well, you get the point. Illusory claims of ‘greatness’ are just that.
We may see a Trump victory. And we need to be prepared to stay at the center, to understand that the order of things in the systems will continue to be a process of persons seeking to create a ‘visionary dream’ – to quote Bonhoeffer – and persons seeking to do what it caring and responsible. And this is true whether or not we see a Trump victory. We’ll have to work in that world as we do now, with an understanding that we will not conquer by destroying an enemy but by being who we are called to be.
Personally, we’ve contributed, voted, and spoken as clearly as we can in the networks and relationships we have. But our ‘heroes’ aren’t the ones who overthrew a tyranny. Our ‘heroes’ are those who cared and sustained even while marginalized and attacked. ‘Lest Innocent Blood be Shed’ is an account of a village that sheltered Jews in France – and did so while being gentle with the Vichy forces. That led to warnings before raids as even those in the Vichy regime chose to care.
Again, FWIW.
Bill
*From:* James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com> *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 8:35 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* w.schlesinger@pvida.net; Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Watching the world series, I am hit by ads similar to the post forwarded by Susan — 3 1/2 years in office and things didn’t get done and now they will —I dont know how to respond to that … help
Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:00 PM, Mari Crocker via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Amen! Dear friend, Bill. Thank you for this, and many other insightful comments you have shared over the years. Fond memories of the time Joe and I spent with your family, way back, when you were discerning your call. Fondly, Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 7:22 PM, <w.schlesinger@pvida.net> < w.schlesinger@pvida.net> wrote:
The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes.
Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge.
Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others…
My two cents.
Bill Schlesinger
*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Mari Crocker via OE *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Hi W.J and other colleagues
I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome".
My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call.
However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light.
Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery.
I know that one's hard to beat!
But it gets worse!
Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory.
But here's what's worse:
Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote.
Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives.
The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal.
This raises what is for me a burning question: why would *any woman* vote for Trump?
And especially any woman who could conceive?
Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second *any other woman* is personally under threat?
As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack?
I just don't get it.
So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if *every* white male voted for Donald Trump, he would *have to lose* if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right?
Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing.
So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why *any* female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous.
I think it comes down to this: *a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles.*
This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships.
In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience.
In my humble opinion!
So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution?
Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage.
The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system.
I invite your responses.
And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote!
Marshall
Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook:
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>
P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
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I dare to suggest that the way transformation happens—often through an external event causing an existential crisis from which we try to escape—is writ large in our moment in history. There are some among us who suggest we are at a 500-year turning point, and new historical perspectives are either on the horizon or just over its edge. Such a change in the past has provoked massive resistance. The Pandora meme suggests that once opened, it can never be closed. We are now a global village—look at the existing global economic infrastructure. I believe what is happening with AI is the cultural infrastructure of this global village. The national alliances in the West, East, and South will force, in my humble opinion (IMHO), a global village political infrastructure. Maybe not in my lifetime, but it is coming. I long ago found developing nations' adoption of Marx somewhat paradoxical because Marx focused on industrialized nations' paths of development. I wonder who in the industrialized nations read and saw their demise in such development and promptly demonized Marx's insights. What exciting times we live in, and what incredible eyeglasses we have developed to taste the richness of life. 828-292-9696 On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 1:37 PM James Wiegel via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Still?? I recall conversations with you and others as far back as 1968 … Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 29, 2024, at 8:43 AM, Holcombe Wanda <wandah70@gmail.com> wrote:
I believe we are in a global cultural malaise and Believe it is in someway as Marilyn shared: *a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity** roles.*
I also since it is also an emerging identity crisis for the male globally also. I don’t remember the figure but it was shared yesterday that 40,000 men committed suicide this year for various reasons.
Whoever wins this election….I perceive it will be up to both the female and male globally to create the new human being and global society.
I hope to they have to be 100 to be a part of that and see what the new human looks like an act like the new GLOBAL CITIZEN…. Wanda 💫✨🌟 Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 29, 2024, at 9:43 AM, James Wiegel via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Thanks Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 29, 2024, at 3:42 AM, w.schlesinger@pvida.net wrote:
It’s hard to respond point by point to demonstrably false statements and charges. COVID was so much more destructive than it needed to have been – largely due to Trump’s refusal to deal with the science and politicizing responses. The resistance to immunizations, use of masking (common in other parts of the world) – well, you get the point. Illusory claims of ‘greatness’ are just that.
We may see a Trump victory. And we need to be prepared to stay at the center, to understand that the order of things in the systems will continue to be a process of persons seeking to create a ‘visionary dream’ – to quote Bonhoeffer – and persons seeking to do what it caring and responsible. And this is true whether or not we see a Trump victory. We’ll have to work in that world as we do now, with an understanding that we will not conquer by destroying an enemy but by being who we are called to be.
Personally, we’ve contributed, voted, and spoken as clearly as we can in the networks and relationships we have. But our ‘heroes’ aren’t the ones who overthrew a tyranny. Our ‘heroes’ are those who cared and sustained even while marginalized and attacked. ‘Lest Innocent Blood be Shed’ is an account of a village that sheltered Jews in France – and did so while being gentle with the Vichy forces. That led to warnings before raids as even those in the Vichy regime chose to care.
Again, FWIW.
Bill
*From:* James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com> *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 8:35 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* w.schlesinger@pvida.net; Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Watching the world series, I am hit by ads similar to the post forwarded by Susan — 3 1/2 years in office and things didn’t get done and now they will —I dont know how to respond to that … help
Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:00 PM, Mari Crocker via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Amen! Dear friend, Bill. Thank you for this, and many other insightful comments you have shared over the years. Fond memories of the time Joe and I spent with your family, way back, when you were discerning your call. Fondly, Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 7:22 PM, <w.schlesinger@pvida.net> < w.schlesinger@pvida.net> wrote:
The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes.
Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge.
Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others…
My two cents.
Bill Schlesinger
*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Mari Crocker via OE *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Hi W.J and other colleagues
I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome".
My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call.
However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light.
Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery.
I know that one's hard to beat!
But it gets worse!
Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory.
But here's what's worse:
Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote.
Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives.
The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal.
This raises what is for me a burning question: why would *any woman* vote for Trump?
And especially any woman who could conceive?
Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second *any other woman* is personally under threat?
As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack?
I just don't get it.
So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if *every* white male voted for Donald Trump, he would *have to lose* if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right?
Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing.
So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why *any* female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous.
I think it comes down to this: *a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles.*
This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships.
In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience.
In my humble opinion!
So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution?
Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage.
The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system.
I invite your responses.
And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote!
Marshall
Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook:
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>
P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <https://www.google.com/url?q=http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net&source=gmail-imap&ust=1730774139000000&usg=AOvVaw0YbbLh1LlRexTn9X0qMwDL>
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A further thought: If we extended the Question of GOD lecture-how would we characterized each decade since the 50's? Would the time span be shorter than 10 years? 828-292-9696 On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 2:32 PM Don Bushman <onedonbushman@gmail.com> wrote:
I dare to suggest that the way transformation happens—often through an external event causing an existential crisis from which we try to escape—is writ large in our moment in history.
There are some among us who suggest we are at a 500-year turning point, and new historical perspectives are either on the horizon or just over its edge. Such a change in the past has provoked massive resistance.
The Pandora meme suggests that once opened, it can never be closed. We are now a global village—look at the existing global economic infrastructure. I believe what is happening with AI is the cultural infrastructure of this global village. The national alliances in the West, East, and South will force, in my humble opinion (IMHO), a global village political infrastructure. Maybe not in my lifetime, but it is coming.
I long ago found developing nations' adoption of Marx somewhat paradoxical because Marx focused on industrialized nations' paths of development. I wonder who in the industrialized nations read and saw their demise in such development and promptly demonized Marx's insights.
What exciting times we live in, and what incredible eyeglasses we have developed to taste the richness of life.
828-292-9696
On Tue, Oct 29, 2024 at 1:37 PM James Wiegel via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Still?? I recall conversations with you and others as far back as 1968 … Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 29, 2024, at 8:43 AM, Holcombe Wanda <wandah70@gmail.com> wrote:
I believe we are in a global cultural malaise and Believe it is in someway as Marilyn shared: *a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity** roles.*
I also since it is also an emerging identity crisis for the male globally also. I don’t remember the figure but it was shared yesterday that 40,000 men committed suicide this year for various reasons.
Whoever wins this election….I perceive it will be up to both the female and male globally to create the new human being and global society.
I hope to they have to be 100 to be a part of that and see what the new human looks like an act like the new GLOBAL CITIZEN…. Wanda 💫✨🌟 Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 29, 2024, at 9:43 AM, James Wiegel via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Thanks Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 29, 2024, at 3:42 AM, w.schlesinger@pvida.net wrote:
It’s hard to respond point by point to demonstrably false statements and charges. COVID was so much more destructive than it needed to have been – largely due to Trump’s refusal to deal with the science and politicizing responses. The resistance to immunizations, use of masking (common in other parts of the world) – well, you get the point. Illusory claims of ‘greatness’ are just that.
We may see a Trump victory. And we need to be prepared to stay at the center, to understand that the order of things in the systems will continue to be a process of persons seeking to create a ‘visionary dream’ – to quote Bonhoeffer – and persons seeking to do what it caring and responsible. And this is true whether or not we see a Trump victory. We’ll have to work in that world as we do now, with an understanding that we will not conquer by destroying an enemy but by being who we are called to be.
Personally, we’ve contributed, voted, and spoken as clearly as we can in the networks and relationships we have. But our ‘heroes’ aren’t the ones who overthrew a tyranny. Our ‘heroes’ are those who cared and sustained even while marginalized and attacked. ‘Lest Innocent Blood be Shed’ is an account of a village that sheltered Jews in France – and did so while being gentle with the Vichy forces. That led to warnings before raids as even those in the Vichy regime chose to care.
Again, FWIW.
Bill
*From:* James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com> *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 8:35 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* w.schlesinger@pvida.net; Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Watching the world series, I am hit by ads similar to the post forwarded by Susan — 3 1/2 years in office and things didn’t get done and now they will —I dont know how to respond to that … help
Jim Wiegel
“…the long work of turning their lives into a celebration is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:00 PM, Mari Crocker via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Amen! Dear friend, Bill. Thank you for this, and many other insightful comments you have shared over the years. Fond memories of the time Joe and I spent with your family, way back, when you were discerning your call. Fondly, Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 7:22 PM, <w.schlesinger@pvida.net> < w.schlesinger@pvida.net> wrote:
The vice-presidential candidate studied Rene Girard’s work – and betrayed it. He’s taken mimetic desire (I want what I see others having) and scapegoating (if we get rid of ‘them’ we’ll solve our problems, so let us link arms and attack ‘them’) as recipes for victory instead of the driver for and betrayal of innocent suffering that Girard describes.
Trump creates the incredibly powerful tool that ended up crucifying Jesus – and in so doing, disclosed the horror and emptiness of that for the future. And as has been seen, when one ‘they’ has been disposed, the tool must find another – and turns on itself in a cannibalistic process of eating its own. Thus the ‘RINO’ charge.
Rubbing raw the sores of discontent can lead to this kind of destruction – and in an angry rejection of other values. Attacking it in kind only strengthens the method. Unfortunately, innocent suffering is the only tool that stops it – at cost. Thus the nonviolence movements of Gandhi and MLK Jr. and others…
My two cents.
Bill Schlesinger
*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Mari Crocker via OE *Sent:* Monday, October 28, 2024 5:06 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* Mari Crocker <maricrocker@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] bizarre
Hi W.J and other colleagues
I appreciate your analysis, and would add to your assessment of a “cultural backlash against cultural change” and “the perpetuation of the ancient archetype of female subservience,” the side-effects (like those of a deleterious drug) of "the abused woman syndrome".
My sister typifies the abused woman, who continued to submit to abuse by “staying in the marriage for the sake of the kids", and when she shook loose of marital abuse, she submitted to abuse by her sons, who of course learned from the role model of their father. One son did it by direct physical and emotional demeaning; the other by distancing himself geographically and abdicating any “hands-on” support to his mother when she was diagnosed with dementia, save for an occasional phone call.
However, despite her dementia, my sister cast her absentee ballot for Kamala. Even with dementia she saw the light.
Marilyn
On Oct 28, 2024, at 5:45 PM, W. J. via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
We're in the closing days of the most bizarre U.S. election campaign in my memory. According to Barack, N.C. Lt. Gov. Robinson, the Repugnant candidate for governor, is a self-described "Black Nazi" who wants to bring back slavery.
I know that one's hard to beat!
But it gets worse!
Robinson will be defeated on November 5, rather than riding into the governor's mansion on the coattails of Trump's predicted N.C. victory.
But here's what's worse:
Trump could narrowly win in the electoral college while losing the popular vote.
Or he could narrowly lose the election, refuse to concede, and contest the election by casting doubt on its legitimacy and creating chaos in the electoral college, throwing the election to the House of Representatives.
The critical voter block that will guarantee either outcome are female Trump voters, almost all of whom are white, and most of whom are not college graduates and are predominantly postmenopausal.
This raises what is for me a burning question: why would *any woman* vote for Trump?
And especially any woman who could conceive?
Why would any woman not deeply understand that she is personally under threat the second *any other woman* is personally under threat?
As well as being a member of a large group that is now directly under attack?
I just don't get it.
So, given the racial and gender gap in the American electorate, even if *every* white male voted for Donald Trump, he would *have to lose* if every female plus every person of color voted for Kamala. Right?
Based on this logic, the reality that I just can't predict that Trump will lose is deeply disturbing.
So I've tried to plumb the mystery of why *any* female (including my sister, who has voted for Trump twice before) would be determined to vote for Trump despite all the indisputable evidence that electing Trump in 2024 would be disastrous.
I think it comes down to this: *a cultural backlash against global change that is perceived as both virtually inevitable and threatening to the survival of their traditional female gender identity roles.*
This perception of a diffuse but global threat to their sense of security in their traditional sense of self can lead female Trump voters to unconsciously self-destructive behavior, in that they can vote for Trump while at the same hating him personally as the embodiment of a threatening male dominance that they have had to put up with in their intimate familial relationships.
In short, females voting for Trump perpetuate the ancient archetype of female subservience.
In my humble opinion!
So why are any female voters so profoundly stuck in this personal dilemma? Of rebelling against the dominance of a male establishment by voting for a fascist wanna-be dictator who exudes a shrunken and impotent sense of male dominance while he attacks the American Constitution?
Perhaps those of you who are female can see more deeply into this contradiction than I can manage.
The best I can suggest is to place this existential disturbance somewhere in the area of "cultural impoverishment", and perhaps in the category of being "spiritually vulnerable" to what we used to call "brainwashing". And thus resistant to reality-based messages that contradict personal beliefs that are determined by a myth system.
I invite your responses.
And if you're a registered voter, don't neglect to vote!
Marshall
Finally, I just can't get why any woman in our group would insist on trashing Kamala. Yet here's what Susan Fertig posted on Facebook:
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>
P.S. Maybe Trump thinks of the electoral college as another iteration of Trump University! A scam he can manipulate to get what he wants.
<457488282_2891520291010734_7975706897851416784_n.jpg>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <https://www.google.com/url?q=http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net&source=gmail-imap&ust=1730774139000000&usg=AOvVaw0YbbLh1LlRexTn9X0qMwDL>
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participants (8)
-
Don Bushman -
Holcombe Wanda -
James Wiegel -
Judi White -
Mari Crocker -
Nancy Trask -
W. J. -
w.schlesinger＠pvida.net