Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
I just thought it was a good refection Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE SmartphoneSusan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com> wrote:Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it. Susan From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney The Real Romney Jonathan Chait says the hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..." "The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class." _____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com
I realize, too, that I’m not sure which, if any, were your own words and not part of the review. I took the quote marks to be the review portion and the top part to be yours, and I may have got that wrong. Susan From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of HERMAN GREENE Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 12:04 PM To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney I just thought it was a good refection Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone Susan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com> wrote: Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it. Susan From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney <http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/18/the_real_romney.html> The Real Romney <http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/real-romney-is-a-sneering-plutocrat.html> Jonathan Chait says the <http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/17/romney_explains_obama_voters.html> hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..." "The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class." _____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com
None of the words were written by me. Herman _____ From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Susan Fertig Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:32 PM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney I realize, too, that Im not sure which, if any, were your own words and not part of the review. I took the quote marks to be the review portion and the top part to be yours, and I may have got that wrong. Susan From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of HERMAN GREENE Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 12:04 PM To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney I just thought it was a good refection Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone Susan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com> wrote: Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and Im offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it. Susan From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] <mailto:%5bmailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net%5d> On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney <http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/18/the_real_romney.html> The Real Romney <http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/real-romney-is-a-sneering-plutocrat.ht ml> Jonathan Chait says the <http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/17/romney_explains_obama_voters.h tml> hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..." "The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class." _____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com
I'm sorry that this conversation has fallen to such a level. The mention of Kool Aid, which references the killing of people in the Jones Town tragedy, is saddening to me. And the idea we came close to becoming a cult as well. We still are an expression of movemental force. Of course Lingo has said there are as many versions of the Order as there are participants; take that as you may. My experience of this list serve is that of trans-establishment. It is not about a balance of political statements, establisment vs. dis-establishment views or prejudicial statements, but a wrestling with the future from our various perspectives. This is a very different type of discussion from the talking heads on U.S. media. It has grown out of our experience. We are all not the same, but we seek respectful dialogue and we work pretty hard to stick to the facts as best we can grasp them. Hopefully we can resume that level of discussion. As a participant in a number of list serves and a manager of one, I have found this one to be very good. Herman has brought us a lot of good material to struggle with and I look forward to that to continue. Most of the time I have noticed that when someone disagrees with another, we state what we see to be the case rather than to attack the other. Our world is changing very rapidly, practicing respectful dialogue might be a good practice for the future. George Holcombe 14900 Yellowleaf Tr. Austin, TX 78728 Mobile 512/252-2756 geowanda@earthlink.net Hope appeareth, but it is not your Hope—you do not have anything to do with it. It just appeareth. It comes as a stranger, as an alien—it just appeareth! You do not even know why you hope. How in the world could you hope when there is absolutely nothing to justify any hope? ~Joseph W. Mathews On Sep 18, 2012, at 11:04 AM, HERMAN GREENE <hfgreene@mindspring.com> wrote:
I just thought it was a good refection
Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone
Susan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com> wrote: Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it.
Susan
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
The Real Romney Jonathan Chait says the hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..."
"The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class."
_____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Thanks, George. Here's to the dialogue—may it be respectful. The world needs that from each of us.--Diann McCabe From: George Holcombe <geowanda@earthlink.net<mailto:geowanda@earthlink.net>> Reply-To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> Date: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 3:15 PM To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney I'm sorry that this conversation has fallen to such a level. The mention of Kool Aid, which references the killing of people in the Jones Town tragedy, is saddening to me. And the idea we came close to becoming a cult as well. We still are an expression of movemental force. Of course Lingo has said there are as many versions of the Order as there are participants; take that as you may. My experience of this list serve is that of trans-establishment. It is not about a balance of political statements, establisment vs. dis-establishment views or prejudicial statements, but a wrestling with the future from our various perspectives. This is a very different type of discussion from the talking heads on U.S. media. It has grown out of our experience. We are all not the same, but we seek respectful dialogue and we work pretty hard to stick to the facts as best we can grasp them. Hopefully we can resume that level of discussion. As a participant in a number of list serves and a manager of one, I have found this one to be very good. Herman has brought us a lot of good material to struggle with and I look forward to that to continue. Most of the time I have noticed that when someone disagrees with another, we state what we see to be the case rather than to attack the other. Our world is changing very rapidly, practicing respectful dialogue might be a good practice for the future. George Holcombe 14900 Yellowleaf Tr. Austin, TX 78728 Mobile 512/252-2756 geowanda@earthlink.net<mailto:geowanda@earthlink.net> Hope appeareth, but it is not your Hope—you do not have anything to do with it. It just appeareth. It comes as a stranger, as an alien—it just appeareth! You do not even know why you hope. How in the world could you hope when there is absolutely nothing to justify any hope? ~Joseph W. Mathews On Sep 18, 2012, at 11:04 AM, HERMAN GREENE <hfgreene@mindspring.com<mailto:hfgreene@mindspring.com>> wrote: I just thought it was a good refection Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone Susan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com<mailto:susan@gmdtech.com>> wrote: Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it. Susan From:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net>] On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney The Real Romney<http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/18/the_real_romney.html> Jonathan Chait<http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/real-romney-is-a-sneering-plutocrat.html> says the hidden camera video<http://politicalwire.com/archives/2012/09/17/romney_explains_obama_voters.html> that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..." "The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class." _____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com<mailto:hfgreene@mindspring.com> _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
"Like." Ken On 2012-09-18, at 4:15 PM, George Holcombe wrote: I'm sorry that this conversation has fallen to such a level. The mention of Kool Aid, which references the killing of people in the Jones Town tragedy, is saddening to me. And the idea we came close to becoming a cult as well. We still are an expression of movemental force. Of course Lingo has said there are as many versions of the Order as there are participants; take that as you may. My experience of this list serve is that of trans-establishment. It is not about a balance of political statements, establisment vs. dis-establishment views or prejudicial statements, but a wrestling with the future from our various perspectives. This is a very different type of discussion from the talking heads on U.S. media. It has grown out of our experience. We are all not the same, but we seek respectful dialogue and we work pretty hard to stick to the facts as best we can grasp them. Hopefully we can resume that level of discussion. As a participant in a number of list serves and a manager of one, I have found this one to be very good. Herman has brought us a lot of good material to struggle with and I look forward to that to continue. Most of the time I have noticed that when someone disagrees with another, we state what we see to be the case rather than to attack the other. Our world is changing very rapidly, practicing respectful dialogue might be a good practice for the future. George Holcombe 14900 Yellowleaf Tr. Austin, TX 78728 Mobile 512/252-2756 geowanda@earthlink.net Hope appeareth, but it is not your Hope—you do not have anything to do with it. It just appeareth. It comes as a stranger, as an alien—it just appeareth! You do not even know why you hope. How in the world could you hope when there is absolutely nothing to justify any hope? ~Joseph W. Mathews On Sep 18, 2012, at 11:04 AM, HERMAN GREENE <hfgreene@mindspring.com> wrote:
I just thought it was a good refection
Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone
Susan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com> wrote: Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it.
Susan
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
The Real Romney Jonathan Chait says the hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..."
"The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class."
_____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Thank you, George. As usual you ... you are someone I listen to with respect. Priscilla On Sep 18, 2012, at 3:15 PM, George Holcombe wrote:
I'm sorry that this conversation has fallen to such a level. The mention of Kool Aid, which references the killing of people in the Jones Town tragedy, is saddening to me. And the idea we came close to becoming a cult as well. We still are an expression of movemental force. Of course Lingo has said there are as many versions of the Order as there are participants; take that as you may.
My experience of this list serve is that of trans-establishment. It is not about a balance of political statements, establisment vs. dis-establishment views or prejudicial statements, but a wrestling with the future from our various perspectives. This is a very different type of discussion from the talking heads on U.S. media. It has grown out of our experience. We are all not the same, but we seek respectful dialogue and we work pretty hard to stick to the facts as best we can grasp them. Hopefully we can resume that level of discussion. As a participant in a number of list serves and a manager of one, I have found this one to be very good. Herman has brought us a lot of good material to struggle with and I look forward to that to continue.
Most of the time I have noticed that when someone disagrees with another, we state what we see to be the case rather than to attack the other. Our world is changing very rapidly, practicing respectful dialogue might be a good practice for the future.
George Holcombe 14900 Yellowleaf Tr. Austin, TX 78728 Mobile 512/252-2756 geowanda@earthlink.net
Hope appeareth, but it is not your Hope—you do not have anything to do with it. It just appeareth. It comes as a stranger, as an alien—it just appeareth! You do not even know why you hope. How in the world could you hope when there is absolutely nothing to justify any hope? ~Joseph W. Mathews
On Sep 18, 2012, at 11:04 AM, HERMAN GREENE <hfgreene@mindspring.com> wrote:
I just thought it was a good refection
Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone
Susan Fertig <susan@gmdtech.com> wrote: Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it.
Susan
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:21 AM To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' Subject: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
The Real Romney Jonathan Chait says the hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..."
"The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naïve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class."
_____________________________________________ Herman Greene 2516 Winningham Drive Chapel Hill, NC 27516 919-929-4116 (h) 919-624-0579 (c) 919-942-4358 (f) Skype: hgreene-nc hfgreene@mindspring.com
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Priscilla H Wilson Pris@TeamTechPress.com 913-432-2107 www.teamtechpress.com
Well said George, and thank you! Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: George Holcombe <geowanda@earthlink.net> Sender: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.netDate: Tue, 18 Sep 2012 15:15:06 To: Order Ecumenical Community<oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Reply-To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
participants (8)
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George Holcombe -
Herman Greene -
HERMAN GREENE
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Joyce Sloan -
Ken Fisher -
McCabe, Diann A -
Susan Fertig -
Wilson Priscilla