Susan, Thank you for sharing your thoughts. Please help me understand the concerns you have that are prohibiting you from relying on the consensus of the national NEWS reports. The 2016 popular vote was closer than the current balance. How many court challenges were there at that time? How many did you support? I am interested in what you see. So please help me understand. In respect, Paula On Sun, Nov 8, 2020 at 11:43 AM Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%.

He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

*Susan*

Susan Fertig-Dykes

*And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought . Isaiah 58:11*

*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Cynthia Vance via OE *Sent:* Sunday, November 08, 2020 8:14 AM *To:* oe@lists.wedgeblade.net *Cc:* Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

We're joining the world of nations again!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measure...

Cynthia Vance

facilitationfla@aol.com

-----Original Message----- From: Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> To: Beret Griffith via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Isobel and Jim Bishop <isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au> Sent: Sun, Nov 8, 2020 12:32 am Subject: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Dear colleagues,

We are so pleased and relieved about your election results!

Best wishes to every one.

Isobel & Jim

Isobel and Jim Bishop

isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au

_______________________________________________

OE mailing list

OE@lists.wedgeblade.net

http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

-- Paula Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony. Mahatma Gandhi

Interesting--I did some simple numbers US eligible to vote population 253,768,092 how many total eligible voted 146,359,357 For Biden 75,310,576 For Trump 71,048,781 Percent of total eligible US adults voted 58% Percent of US adults who voted for Biden 30% Percent of US adults who voted for Trump 28% So total US voters are slightly more than a majority of eligible voters in the US. I would not want to commit the USA to a war effort on that slim majority. The division in the USA is much more complex than the two camps of our two major parties. Don Bushman On Sun, Nov 8, 2020 at 12:32 PM Elsa Batica via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

Dear Susan, Please allow me to address you in an informal way. You don’t know me but I was in the Cebu RH, Sudtonggan HDP, Centrum, Azpitia HDP and the Minneapolis RH. I’m interested to find out what in this administration do you support if you said you’re one of the other 50 percent? Thank you. Elsa

Sent from my iPhone Batica & Associates

On Nov 8, 2020, at 12:18 PM, Paula Philbrook via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

 Susan, Thank you for sharing your thoughts. Please help me understand the concerns you have that are prohibiting you from relying on the consensus of the national NEWS reports.

The 2016 popular vote was closer than the current balance. How many court challenges were there at that time? How many did you support?

I am interested in what you see. So please help me understand.

In respect, Paula

On Sun, Nov 8, 2020 at 11:43 AM Susan Fertig via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

...

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%.

He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

*Susan*

Susan Fertig-Dykes

*And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought . Isaiah 58:11*

*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Cynthia Vance via OE *Sent:* Sunday, November 08, 2020 8:14 AM *To:* oe@lists.wedgeblade.net *Cc:* Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

We're joining the world of nations again!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measure...

Cynthia Vance

facilitationfla@aol.com

-----Original Message----- From: Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> To: Beret Griffith via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Isobel and Jim Bishop <isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au> Sent: Sun, Nov 8, 2020 12:32 am Subject: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Dear colleagues,

We are so pleased and relieved about your election results!

Best wishes to every one.

Isobel & Jim

Isobel and Jim Bishop

isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au

_______________________________________________

OE mailing list

OE@lists.wedgeblade.net

http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

-- Paula

Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony. Mahatma Gandhi _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

Susan's gotta do what Susan's gotta do.After she voted to nullify my right to exist, now she wants to nullify--or at least skew public perception of--the apparent outcome. That's called Denial.The transition officially starts (with federal funding and administrative cooperation with the Biden transition team) when the head of the GSA acknowledges the election outcome. Under tremendous political pressure to avoid that step, she may or may not cave--temporarily. We'll see how long de Nile continues to flow.Marshall On Sunday, November 8, 2020, 11:14:10 AM PST, Elsa Batica via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Dear Susan,Please allow me to address you in an informal way. You don’t know me but I was in the Cebu RH, Sudtonggan HDP, Centrum, Azpitia HDP and the Minneapolis RH.I’m interested to find out what in this administration do you support if you said you’re one of the other 50 percent? Thank you.Elsa Sent from my iPhoneBatica & Associates On Nov 8, 2020, at 12:18 PM, Paula Philbrook via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Susan,Thank you for sharing your thoughts.   Please help me understand the concerns you have that are prohibiting you from relying on the consensus of the national NEWS reports. The 2016 popular vote was closer than the current balance.  How many court challenges were there at that time? How many did you support?   I am interested in what you see.  So please help me understand. In respect,Paula On Sun, Nov 8, 2020 at 11:43 AM Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%. He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.   Susan   Susan Fertig-Dykes   And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought .  Isaiah 58:11   From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> On Behalf OfCynthia Vance via OE Sent: Sunday, November 08, 2020 8:14 AM To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net Cc: Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!   Thank you, thank you, thank you!   We're joining the world of nations again!!   https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measure...   Cynthia Vance facilitationfla@aol.com   -----Original Message----- From: Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> To: Beret Griffith via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Isobel and Jim Bishop <isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au> Sent: Sun, Nov 8, 2020 12:32 am Subject: [Oe List ...] Hooray! Dear colleagues,   We are so pleased and relieved about your election results!   Best wishes to every one.   Isobel & Jim     Isobel and  Jim Bishop isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au           _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net -- Paula   Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony.     Mahatma Gandhi _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

Very thoughtful and generous response Paula! I posted a couple of appeals on FB for those who voted for Trump to be as willing to honor the process we have set up for managing our elections as we were in the last election. Those who have accused the Secretaries of State and the thousands of volunteers from both parties at ballot counting stations of voter fraud need to come up with evidence for their accusations as Chris Christy and other Republicans are saying. Or else stop their nonsensical behavior and accept the wil of the American people who have voted in a bigger majority than any election in the past. Milan H Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 8, 2020, at 10:37 AM, Paula Philbrook via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

 Susan, Thank you for sharing your thoughts. Please help me understand the concerns you have that are prohibiting you from relying on the consensus of the national NEWS reports.

The 2016 popular vote was closer than the current balance. How many court challenges were there at that time? How many did you support?

I am interested in what you see. So please help me understand.

In respect, Paula

...

On Sun, Nov 8, 2020 at 11:43 AM Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%.

He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

Susan

Susan Fertig-Dykes

And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought . Isaiah 58:11

From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> On Behalf Of Cynthia Vance via OE Sent: Sunday, November 08, 2020 8:14 AM To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net Cc: Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

We're joining the world of nations again!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measure...

Cynthia Vance

facilitationfla@aol.com

-----Original Message----- From: Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> To: Beret Griffith via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Isobel and Jim Bishop <isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au> Sent: Sun, Nov 8, 2020 12:32 am Subject: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Dear colleagues,

We are so pleased and relieved about your election results!

Best wishes to every one.

Isobel & Jim

Isobel and Jim Bishop

isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au

_______________________________________________

OE mailing list

OE@lists.wedgeblade.net

http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net -- Paula

Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony. Mahatma Gandhi _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

Bill and All, I agree with what you said, and also David Becker’s comment. They are correct. I was joyful at the results. But we must listen to what Susan is saying, for as much as we feel she is “wrong” the place from which it comes is real. I know Susan and have listened to her before. She probably would agree with us that those who demonize and threaten others are not helpful. I will try and take us to that land. I think everyone would agree that if you redrew the lines of the United States you could do it in a way that would change the results. They are a social invention, done in a time without grasping the full consequences of the arbitrary lines for so many years into the future. So we have stuck with them and lived with the results for all these years, but each time it gets to a point where a small shift would make a different result. One side says “suck it up, you lost” and the other finds reasons to say “no more sucking”. The tension gets tighter and tighter, the sides get their feet in cement. One option is to say, well, Biden will get us back to “normal” where the forces that are acting elsewhere in the world on this same issue are saying no as well. The USA just seems to be the worst right now. Not many years ago we told the Native Americans to “suck it up” (or die). My point is that this conversation leads only one way, into a downward spiral into chaos. We need dialogue, not conversation. A dialogue starts with the premise that we all have dirty hands, therefore it is a confessional stance. Secondly, it works only when you fully understand what the other is saying (not agree). They (and we) need to be satisfied that you truly can stand where they stand and see what they see, and vice versa. What is the “common ground”? Our humanity, the infinite worth of us all, broken as we may be. This is not easy. But demonizing the other human beings is what can destroy us, from either side. We all need to heed John Lewis; Love (agape) is the answer, and trust the Mystery. Peace, Jack

On Nov 8, 2020, at 1:25 PM, Bill Schlesinger via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

It is true that the world is not a monolith. It is also true that there are court challenges. However, we have accepted the title of ‘president elect’ for many called elections won by a similar percentage in the past. And even in 2000 we did not demonize the workers. We did not consider our fellow citizens to be traitors.

DAVID BECKER: They are very concerned. I talked to some of them yesterday. There are- these are people who have been away from their families for days. They haven't seen the much. One of them, his son, just had a birthday and he had to miss that birthday, essentially because he was working the polls. They are getting no sleep. They're getting death threats. Some of them include racist and anti-Semitic language. And then we hear about this threat on their lives. It's shameful. I mean, these are public servants who are doing you know, they're not always well-paid. They're not really well paid at all. They don't get a lot of recognition. Usually when we only know their names, when something goes wrong, they're really heroes of democracy right now.

From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net>> On Behalf Of Susan Fertig via OE Sent: Sunday, November 8, 2020 10:44 AM To: Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com <mailto:facilitationfla@aol.com>>; Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> Cc: Susan Fertig <sfertig@blueskytech.us <mailto:sfertig@blueskytech.us>> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%. He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

Susan

Susan Fertig-Dykes

And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought . Isaiah 58:11

From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net>> On Behalf Of Cynthia Vance via OE Sent: Sunday, November 08, 2020 8:14 AM To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com <mailto:facilitationfla@aol.com>> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

We're joining the world of nations again!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measure... <https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measures/2020/11/07/9fb9c1d0-210b-11eb-b532-05c751cd5dc2_story.html?fbclid=IwAR2N_Af7bDqFLmqOimIKiCFdEjEovBUQ9OTkxX95mZvezvvLNk0eUMI389A>

Cynthia Vance facilitationfla@aol.com <mailto:facilitationfla@aol.com>

-----Original Message----- From: Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> To: Beret Griffith via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> Cc: Isobel and Jim Bishop <isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au <mailto:isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au>> Sent: Sun, Nov 8, 2020 12:32 am Subject: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Dear colleagues,

We are so pleased and relieved about your election results!

Best wishes to every one.

Isobel & Jim

Isobel and Jim Bishop isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au <mailto:isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au>

_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net>

I appreciate that your concern was gloating and not denying the outcome. On Sun, Nov 8, 2020, 2:47 PM Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

First of all, thank you to all who wrote in a caring way, most of all to you Jack.

For the others, let me ask you, In my post:

Did I say “it ain’t fair” or “we should continue fighting”? No.

Did I ask you all to justify the integrity of the election results? No.

Did I call Joe Biden or Kamala Harris names? No.

Did I say that I thought Donald Trump was God’s gift to mankind? No.

I simply opined that it was a close election and that gloating over the outcome did not behoove anyone.

I’m not going to rise to the bait and tell you everything that was wrong with the election. So quitcherbitchen.

*Susan*

Susan Fertig-Dykes

*And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought . Isaiah 58:11*

*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Jack Gilles via OE *Sent:* Sunday, November 08, 2020 4:37 PM *To:* Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* Jack Gilles <jackcgilles@gmail.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Bill and All,

I agree with what you said, and also David Becker’s comment. They are correct. I was joyful at the results. But we must listen to what Susan is saying, for as much as we feel she is “wrong” the place from which it comes is real. I know Susan and have listened to her before. She probably would agree with us that those who demonize and threaten others are not helpful. I will try and take us to that land.

I think everyone would agree that if you redrew the lines of the United States you could do it in a way that would change the results. They are a social invention, done in a time without grasping the full consequences of the arbitrary lines for so many years into the future. So we have stuck with them and lived with the results for all these years, but each time it gets to a point where a small shift would make a different result. One side says “suck it up, you lost” and the other finds reasons to say “no more sucking”. The tension gets tighter and tighter, the sides get their feet in cement. One option is to say, well, Biden will get us back to “normal” where the forces that are acting elsewhere in the world on this same issue are saying no as well. The USA just seems to be the worst right now. Not many years ago we told the Native Americans to “suck it up” (or die).

My point is that this conversation leads only one way, into a downward spiral into chaos. We need dialogue, not conversation. A dialogue starts with the premise that we all have dirty hands, therefore it is a confessional stance. Secondly, it works only when you fully understand what the other is saying (not agree). They (and we) need to be satisfied that you truly can stand where they stand and see what they see, and vice versa. What is the “common ground”? Our humanity, the infinite worth of us all, broken as we may be. This is not easy. But demonizing the other human beings is what can destroy us, from either side. We all need to heed John Lewis; Love (agape) is the answer, and trust the Mystery.

Peace,

Jack

On Nov 8, 2020, at 1:25 PM, Bill Schlesinger via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

It is true that the world is not a monolith. It is also true that there are court challenges. However, we have accepted the title of ‘president elect’ for many called elections won by a similar percentage in the past. And even in 2000 we did not demonize the workers. We did not consider our fellow citizens to be traitors.

DAVID BECKER: They are very concerned. I talked to some of them yesterday. There are- these are people who have been away from their families for days. They haven't seen the much. One of them, his son, just had a birthday and he had to miss that birthday, essentially because he was working the polls. They are getting no sleep. They're getting death threats. Some of them include racist and anti-Semitic language. And then we hear about this threat on their lives. It's shameful. I mean, these are public servants who are doing you know, they're not always well-paid. They're not really well paid at all. They don't get a lot of recognition. Usually when we only know their names, when something goes wrong, they're really heroes of democracy right now.

*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Susan Fertig via OE *Sent:* Sunday, November 8, 2020 10:44 AM *To:* Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com>; Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> *Cc:* Susan Fertig <sfertig@blueskytech.us> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%.

He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

*Susan*

Susan Fertig-Dykes

*And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought . Isaiah 58:11*

*From:* OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> *On Behalf Of *Cynthia Vance via OE *Sent:* Sunday, November 08, 2020 8:14 AM *To:* oe@lists.wedgeblade.net *Cc:* Cynthia Vance <facilitationfla@aol.com> *Subject:* Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

We're joining the world of nations again!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-first-executive-orders-measure...

Cynthia Vance

facilitationfla@aol.com

-----Original Message----- From: Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> To: Beret Griffith via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Isobel and Jim Bishop <isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au> Sent: Sun, Nov 8, 2020 12:32 am Subject: [Oe List ...] Hooray!

Dear colleagues,

We are so pleased and relieved about your election results!

Best wishes to every one.

Isobel & Jim

Isobel and Jim Bishop

isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au

_______________________________________________

OE mailing list

OE@lists.wedgeblade.net

http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

-- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: This transmission may contain confidential information belonging to the sender that is legally privileged and proprietary and may be subject to protection under the law, including the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA). If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you

Greetings colleagues. It’s too soon and a bit uncouth to shoot “Hooray!” I can report a great sigh of relief followed, however, by a deeply anxiety “Oh S**t, we’ve got a lot of work to do.” Two thoughts: 1. I believe, on good evidence, that it is a statement of fact that, as of last night, of the 146,361,058 ballots counted, 50.5% were for V. P. Biden and 47.7% were for Pres. Trump. When we say President-elect Joe Biden, that’s really shorthand for the more exact phrases like Joe Biden is the "projected President elect" or the "putative President elect”? 2. But to be honest, no matter the turn of phrase, it seems probable that Joe Biden will be inaugurated on January 20. I base that faith statement on an experience of fact, namely, that my colleague at Church of the Holy Family, Gayle C., who was an election judge this year, is a no BS but good-willed and conscientious guardian of free and fair elections. Gayle is the kind of woman, much like you, Susan, that some might call a force of nature. It’s a compliment: people who are forces of nature are the ones who get things done. Gaye has checked in with me regularly to report on how things are going in Aurora where she is the Democrat on the Republican-Democrat team that verifies signatures on ballots against the official electoral signature books. She was also asked this year to be an adjudicator on a bipartisan team of election judges that look at ambiguously marked ballots and discern the intention of the voter when the markings are not clear. One by one, Gayle and her Republican partner examine the unclear ballots with the aim of forming a consensus about who that voter was voting for. As Gayle describes it, such adjudication, though routine, is universally understood to be a sacred trust and high honor to be entrusted with the adjudicator role at the most grassroots level of our electoral process: the precinct. Gayle and her Republican teammates do not mess around. They work long hours, day after day, to be sure that they can vouch for the integrity of the ballot process in their precinct. No one messes with Gayle. I can easily believe, with full trust, that the vast majority of election workers across America are, in their own personal ways, like Gayle. Scrupulous. That’s why it seems to me that our president’s court challenges are the sideshow of a desperate man who is psychically unable to own the fact of loss. I wish I could recall who said yesterday that we really just need to relax and let the legal process play out in full expectation that the judges in the courts will be similarly, as we would expect, scrupulous in their devotion to fact and law. That was rather long winded, but it boils down to this. Now I, personally, feel the weight of this challenge: to support spirit journeys that allow people to embrace both gain and loss as facts of life like birth and death, not linguistic inventions like victory and defeat. It is so painfully obvious that our president, a manifestly broken man from a widely noted broken family, has not gone on the spirit journey that allows him to embrace what is real. His universe cracked when he was a child and he has not been able to rise above that childhood death. Court challenges do not change the fact that our president has lost this election, denies this limit in his life, and inflicts that denial on our democracy. Individual sin has become social sabotage, which boomerangs back as self-sabotage of a political campaign. David

On Nov 8, 2020, at 10:43 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%. He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

— "Mystery, possibility, and the power to choose" David Dunn 740 S Alton Way 9B Denver, CO 80247 720-314-5991 dmdunn1@gmail.com

Tempting though it was, I decided not to take the bait, and let Susan be Susan. Randy

On Nov 9, 2020, at 6:33 AM, Ken Fisher via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:



Sisters & Brothers,

Thank-you, David.

Enfranchise ALL the voters of United States, then it would be obvious that Trump would be out.

Voter repression and jerrymandering is so much a part of the American way.

Here in the province of Ontario, the boundaries for Provincial and Federal elections are the same.

Prisoners vote.

How long oh Lord, how long?

Ken

...

On Nov 8, 2020, at 4:51 PM, David Dunn via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

Greetings colleagues.

It’s too soon and a bit uncouth to shoot “Hooray!” I can report a great sigh of relief followed, however, by a deeply anxiety “Oh S**t, we’ve got a lot of work to do.”

Two thoughts:

1. I believe, on good evidence, that it is a statement of fact that, as of last night, of the 146,361,058 ballots counted, 50.5% were for V. P. Biden and 47.7% were for Pres. Trump. When we say President-elect Joe Biden, that’s really shorthand for the more exact phrases like Joe Biden is the "projected President elect" or the "putative President elect”?

2. But to be honest, no matter the turn of phrase, it seems probable that Joe Biden will be inaugurated on January 20.

I base that faith statement on an experience of fact, namely, that my colleague at Church of the Holy Family, Gayle C., who was an election judge this year, is a no BS but good-willed and conscientious guardian of free and fair elections. Gayle is the kind of woman, much like you, Susan, that some might call a force of nature. It’s a compliment: people who are forces of nature are the ones who get things done.

Gaye has checked in with me regularly to report on how things are going in Aurora where she is the Democrat on the Republican-Democrat team that verifies signatures on ballots against the official electoral signature books. She was also asked this year to be an adjudicator on a bipartisan team of election judges that look at ambiguously marked ballots and discern the intention of the voter when the markings are not clear. One by one, Gayle and her Republican partner examine the unclear ballots with the aim of forming a consensus about who that voter was voting for. As Gayle describes it, such adjudication, though routine, is universally understood to be a sacred trust and high honor to be entrusted with the adjudicator role at the most grassroots level of our electoral process: the precinct. Gayle and her Republican teammates do not mess around. They work long hours, day after day, to be sure that they can vouch for the integrity of the ballot process in their precinct. No one messes with Gayle.

I can easily believe, with full trust, that the vast majority of election workers across America are, in their own personal ways, like Gayle. Scrupulous. That’s why it seems to me that our president’s court challenges are the sideshow of a desperate man who is psychically unable to own the fact of loss.

I wish I could recall who said yesterday that we really just need to relax and let the legal process play out in full expectation that the judges in the courts will be similarly, as we would expect, scrupulous in their devotion to fact and law.

That was rather long winded, but it boils down to this. Now I, personally, feel the weight of this challenge: to support spirit journeys that allow people to embrace both gain and loss as facts of life like birth and death, not linguistic inventions like victory and defeat.

It is so painfully obvious that our president, a manifestly broken man from a widely noted broken family, has not gone on the spirit journey that allows him to embrace what is real. His universe cracked when he was a child and he has not been able to rise above that childhood death.

Court challenges do not change the fact that our president has lost this election, denies this limit in his life, and inflicts that denial on our democracy.

Individual sin has become social sabotage, which boomerangs back as self-sabotage of a political campaign.

David

...

On Nov 8, 2020, at 10:43 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%. He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

—

<DMD email sig photo small-Nov2012.jpg>

"Mystery, possibility, and the power to choose"

David Dunn 740 S Alton Way 9B Denver, CO 80247 720-314-5991 dmdunn1@gmail.com

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Actually it is 48.2% and still going down hill. Cynthia Vancefacilitationfla@aol.com -----Original Message----- From: Lynn via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> To: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> Cc: Lynn <liveandlearn.lynn@gmail.com> Sent: Mon, Nov 9, 2020 8:29 am Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Hooray! https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/11/trumps-lawsuits-are-politi... This article sums up the situation beautifully. This is something I would have shared with mom (Marianna Bailey), so thanks for indulging me. Lynn On Mon, Nov 9, 2020, 6:46 AM Randy Williams via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Tempting though it was, I decided not to take the bait, and let Susan be Susan.Randy On Nov 9, 2020, at 6:33 AM, Ken Fisher via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:  Sisters & Brothers, Thank-you, David. Enfranchise ALL the voters of United States, then it would be obvious that Trump would be out. Voter repression and jerrymandering is so much a part of the American way. Here in the province of Ontario, the boundaries for Provincial and Federal elections are the same. Prisoners vote. How long oh Lord, how long? Ken On Nov 8, 2020, at 4:51 PM, David Dunn via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Greetings colleagues. It’s too soon and a bit uncouth to shoot “Hooray!” I can report a great sigh of relief followed, however, by a deeply anxiety “Oh S**t, we’ve got a lot of work to do.” Two thoughts: 1. I believe, on good evidence, that it is a statement of fact that, as of last night, of the 146,361,058 ballots counted, 50.5% were for V. P. Biden and 47.7% were for Pres. Trump. When we say President-elect Joe Biden, that’s really shorthand for the more exact phrases like Joe Biden is the "projected President elect" or the "putative President elect”? 2. But to be honest, no matter the turn of phrase, it seems probable that Joe Biden will be inaugurated on January 20. I base that faith statement on an experience of fact, namely, that my colleague at Church of the Holy Family, Gayle C., who was an election judge this year, is a no BS but good-willed and conscientious guardian of free and fair elections. Gayle is the kind of woman, much like you, Susan, that some might call a force of nature. It’s a compliment: people who are forces of nature are the ones who get things done. Gaye has checked in with me regularly to report on how things are going in Aurora where she is the Democrat on the Republican-Democrat team that verifies signatures on ballots against the official electoral signature books. She was also asked this year to be an adjudicator on a bipartisan team of election judges that look at ambiguously marked ballots and discern the intention of the voter when the markings are not clear. One by one, Gayle and her Republican partner examine the unclear ballots with the aim of forming a consensus about who that voter was voting for. As Gayle describes it, such adjudication, though routine, is universally understood to be a sacred trust and high honor to be entrusted with the adjudicator role at the most grassroots level of our electoral process: the precinct. Gayle and her Republican teammates do not mess around. They work long hours, day after day, to be sure that they can vouch for the integrity of the ballot process in their precinct. No one messes with Gayle. I can easily believe, with full trust, that the vast majority of election workers across America are, in their own personal ways, like Gayle. Scrupulous. That’s why it seems to me that our president’s court challenges are the sideshow of a desperate man who is psychically unable to own the fact of loss.  I wish I could recall who said yesterday that we really just need to relax and let the legal process play out in full expectation that the judges in the courts will be similarly, as we would expect, scrupulous in their devotion to fact and law. That was rather long winded, but it boils down to this. Now I, personally, feel the weight of this challenge: to support spirit journeys that allow people to embrace both gain and loss as facts of life like birth and death, not linguistic inventions like victory and defeat. It is so painfully obvious that our president, a manifestly broken man from a widely noted broken family, has not gone on the spirit journey that allows him to embrace what is real. His universe cracked when he was a child and he has not been able to rise above that childhood death. Court challenges do not change the fact that our president has lost this election, denies this limit in his life, and inflicts that denial on our democracy.  Individual sin has become social sabotage, which boomerangs back as self-sabotage of a political campaign. David On Nov 8, 2020, at 10:43 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%.He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on. — <DMD email sig photo small-Nov2012.jpg> "Mystery, possibility, and the power to choose" David Dunn 740 S Alton Way 9B Denver, CO 80247 720-314-5991 dmdunn1@gmail.com <PastedGraphic-1.png>_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

Thank you Susan for eliciting this conversation. I might not have looked at the real numbers without your invitation. And certainly after hearing a bit of Biden's speech from the weekend this morning where he talked about *America *making it's choice, I might have fallen into the reduction from which he spoke. At best, Biden was voted for by 30% of the adults in the USA. The numbers suggest to me that more people did not vote than voted for Biden or voted for Trump. And yes we finally had a turnout where more than 50% of the adults in our country voted, just barely. Is it possible to have a consensus administration? Our colleague Ken Fisher would point out our binary system prevents that from happening. And others point out the more divided we become the quicker we will slide down the slope into importance in our global village. I feel our (O:E) long experience has only begun to offer up our contribution to the conversation. [And note to Jack Gillis, my colleague and friend, about the difference between dialogue and conversation. Maybe JWM's narrative about the *artform conversation* instead of the *artform dialogue* was his realization that our current use of the word dialogue was mistaken for the word duologue and he had a thing about the academic practice of criticism and the accompanying dismissal. Who knows? I learned in my reactivity from looking at the Online Etymology site ( https://www.etymonline.com/word/conversation) that dialogue in usage came into being after conversation and fundamentally narrowed the meaning to the exchange of speech. Maybe our artform conversation can encourage whole communities, who indeed live with one another, to engage in creating a shared future.] dialogue (n.) <https://www.etymonline.com/word/dialogue#etymonline_v_8516> c. 1200, "literary work consisting of a conversation between two or more persons," from Old French dialoge and directly from Latin dialogus, from Greek dialogos "conversation, dialogue," related to dialogesthai "converse," from dia "across, between" (see dia-) + legein "speak," from PIE root *leg- (1) "to collect, gather," with derivatives meaning "to speak (to 'pick out words')." Sense extended by c. 1400 to "a conversation between two or more persons." The mistaken belief that it can mean only "conversation between two persons" is from confusion of dia- and di- (1); the error goes back to at least 1532, when trialogue was coined needlessly for "a conversation between three persons." A word that has been used for "conversation between two persons" and cannot mean otherwise is the hybrid duologue (1864). conversation (n.) mid-14c., "place where one lives or dwells," also "general course of actions or habits, manner of conducting oneself in the world," both senses now obsolete; from Old French conversacion "behavior, life, way of life, monastic life," and directly from Latin conversationem (nominative conversatio) "frequent use, frequent abode in a place, intercourse, conversation," noun of action from past-participle stem of conversari "to live, dwell, live with, keep company with," passive voice of conversare "to turn about, turn about with," from assimilated form of com "with, together" (see con- <https://www.etymonline.com/word/con-?ref=etymonline_crossreference>) + versare, frequentative of vertere "to turn" (from PIE root *wer- <https://www.etymonline.com/word/*wer-?ref=etymonline_crossreference#etymonline_v_52647> (2) "to turn, bend"). Sense of "informal interchange of thoughts and sentiments by spoken words" is from 1570s. Used as a synonym for "sexual intercourse" from at least late 14c., hence criminal conversation, a legal term for adultery from late 18c. Conversation-piece is from 1712 as "painting representing a group of figures arranged as if in conversation;" 1784 as "subject for conversation, something to talk about." Don Bushman (with deep gratitude for Susan and Jack and all O:E Saints) On Mon, Nov 9, 2020 at 7:47 AM Lynn via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/11/trumps-lawsuits-are-politi...

This article sums up the situation beautifully. This is something I would have shared with mom (Marianna Bailey), so thanks for indulging me.

Lynn

On Mon, Nov 9, 2020, 6:46 AM Randy Williams via OE < oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

...

Tempting though it was, I decided not to take the bait, and let Susan be Susan. Randy

On Nov 9, 2020, at 6:33 AM, Ken Fisher via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:



Sisters & Brothers,

Thank-you, David.

Enfranchise ALL the voters of United States, then it would be obvious that Trump would be out.

Voter repression and jerrymandering is so much a part of the American way.

Here in the province of Ontario, the boundaries for Provincial and Federal elections are the same.

Prisoners vote.

How long oh Lord, how long?

Ken

On Nov 8, 2020, at 4:51 PM, David Dunn via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

Greetings colleagues.

It’s too soon and a bit uncouth to shoot “Hooray!” I *can* report a great sigh of relief followed, however, by a deeply anxiety “Oh S**t, we’ve got a lot of work to do.”

Two thoughts:

1. I believe, on good evidence, that it is a statement of fact that, as of last night, of the 146,361,058 ballots counted, 50.5% were for V. P. Biden and 47.7% were for Pres. Trump. When we say President-elect Joe Biden, that’s really shorthand for the more exact phrases like Joe Biden is the "projected President elect" or the "putative President elect”?

2. But to be honest, no matter the turn of phrase, it seems probable that Joe Biden will be inaugurated on January 20.

I base that faith statement on an experience of fact, namely, that my colleague at Church of the Holy Family, Gayle C., who was an election judge this year, is a no BS but good-willed and conscientious guardian of free and fair elections. Gayle is the kind of woman, much like you, Susan, that some might call a force of nature. It’s a compliment: people who are forces of nature are the ones who get things done.

Gaye has checked in with me regularly to report on how things are going in Aurora where she is the Democrat on the Republican-Democrat team that verifies signatures on ballots against the official electoral signature books. She was also asked this year to be an adjudicator on a bipartisan team of election judges that look at ambiguously marked ballots and discern the intention of the voter when the markings are not clear. One by one, Gayle and her Republican partner examine the unclear ballots with the aim of forming a consensus about who that voter was voting for. As Gayle describes it, such adjudication, though routine, is universally understood to be a sacred trust and high honor to be entrusted with the adjudicator role at the most grassroots level of our electoral process: the precinct. Gayle and her Republican teammates do not mess around. They work long hours, day after day, to be sure that they can vouch for the integrity of the ballot process in their precinct. No one messes with Gayle.

I can easily believe, with full trust, that the vast majority of election workers across America are, in their own personal ways, like Gayle. Scrupulous. That’s why it seems to me that our president’s court challenges are the sideshow of a desperate man who is psychically unable to own the fact of loss.

I wish I could recall who said yesterday that we really just need to relax and let the legal process play out in full expectation that the judges in the courts will be similarly, as we would expect, scrupulous in their devotion to fact and law.

That was rather long winded, but it boils down to this. Now I, personally, feel the weight of this challenge: to support spirit journeys that allow people to embrace both gain and loss as facts of life like birth and death, not linguistic inventions like victory and defeat.

It is so painfully obvious that our president, a manifestly broken man from a widely noted broken family, has not gone on the spirit journey that allows him to embrace what is real. His universe cracked when he was a child and he has not been able to rise above that childhood death.

Court challenges do not change the fact that our president has lost this election, denies this limit in his life, and inflicts that denial on our democracy.

Individual sin has become social sabotage, which boomerangs back as self-sabotage of a political campaign.

David

On Nov 8, 2020, at 10:43 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

The world is not a monolith. 50% of the people did not vote for Joe Biden. I am in that 50%. He is not yet President-elect. There is still court challenges going on.

—

<DMD email sig photo small-Nov2012.jpg>

"Mystery, possibility, and the power to choose"

David Dunn 740 S Alton Way 9B Denver, CO 80247 720-314-5991 dmdunn1@gmail.com

<PastedGraphic-1.png> _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net

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After foregoing sleep for 3 days and following the machinations of our national drama, I was gratified to live in such interesting times. When the projected winner was announced, I knew I could lend my body to some needed repose after giving a shout out from my door to our 8th-floor hallway. Since we have a diverse resident body, I believe there were some who rued the results and I hope they find solace in Biden's proclamation to be a President for ALL the people including those who did not vote for him. May they pivot to hold him accountable to his word and respond accordingly. For God's sake, there's enough of a task available to command the attention and efforts across our political spectrum.  That reminds me of a couple of family stories involving my son Adam at age 2 when he came to stay with Granny during a Summer Program in Chicago at Kemper. He was listening to music in another room and Granny called to him, "What are you doing, Adam?" He replied, "Getting me some soul!"  May we get in touch with that dimension as we foresee the future that awaits us and our nation. Oh, and another time on that visit to Granny's, she asked Adam one evening, "What did you do today, Adam?" And his response was, "Do today?" May that be our individual response to the expenditure of our corporate energy today and onto tomorrow. Kindfully yours,dawn We love the Final Reality because the Final Reality loved us first.- 1 John 4:19  On Tuesday, November 10, 2020, 05:45:18 AM MST, Judi White via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Thank 6ou, Isobel. You are truly a Global Woman. I just read a more glovalv take on the results of this election. Statistics on votes and electorals  are fine, but in the final count, progress is back in style.  Don't have these statistical results fir Buden/Harris, only on DJT:70+ bores for DJT.This is 29% of all registered voters.  And 21% of total USA population.  No source is truly valid, but these statistics are closer to illuminating TWLI in USA than the 76/71,  270+/214 dichotomy.  I'm ready to go to GA for next 2 months to help balance the Senate. Hope you are enjoying the new weather in Australua now. Judi White On Sun, Nov 8, 2020, 12:32 AM Isobel and Jim Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Dear colleagues, We are so pleased and relieved about your election results! Best wishes to every one. Isobel & Jim Isobel and  Jim Bishop isobeljimbish@optusnet.com.au _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net