Re: [Oe List ...] Salmon: Clinton's relationship to E.I. - Dear Susan
Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a criminal--her vision for the country is my first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. Both of them scare me to death. But neither if the other candidates is really an option either. I fear we're about to see this great American experiment in democracy become something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world. Susan Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White <sophiacircle@gmail.com> wrote: Well, what you wrote is what Frumper repeats over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him. I Personally prefer to read responses to a candidates vision for this nation. Also I stand firm in ny admiration which never ceases, of this woman who has continued in spite of the unbelievable accusations which are so blown up out of the real world of truth and honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?". Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid vision for this nation and this planet? There is no other candidate who shines so brightly and qualified to be an example for our children and grandchildren at this time. Rightly so. On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote: How in the world did you infer that I must be a Trump supporter from my message? Susan Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com<mailto:kenfisher1942@gmail.com>> wrote: Dear Susan, Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 16-year Order member, I am awed by your commitment to American Republicanism and conservative Christianity. How in the world did you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA community and have your world view remain unaffected? From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% supporters of HRC and the image of America she represents. Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald. Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read about that is attributed to Hillary has been most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations. Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, parochial narcissist and most of all a climate change denier? HRC is none of the above. Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet. Your phrase: "only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump. I would invite you to see all that as a projection. Should Trump take ownership of any of the above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree? Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, literary critic, essayist, and environmental activist) describes America in the midst of a Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women. While there are indeed my contradictions in American society that both the Republican and Democratic administrations must answer for, the attached article came closest - for me - in describing how the Republican voice has committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’. Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all Trump supporters who have been left without any vision other than rebellion or depression. We are all responsible. Everyone. Ken in Canada. A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote: Values??? The only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary. I've heard for years about this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement. Susan Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote: Colleagues-- So many raise the question concerning Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I decided to cast this bread upon the waters. The first sign is that while I addressed it to Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped up. Consequently, it may really get to her attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid. Inner Peace, Bill Mrs. Hillary Clinton: It is my prayer that this reaches you concerning your experience in 5th City, Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been at a training event to become known as RS-I. About the same time, a large number of us dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement that grew from our experience in Chicago Ghetto to literally embrace the world. It makes me wonder if your experience under his leadership influenced the values you hold dear, and now wish to step onto the platform of the Presidency to do for our United States and for the world what was embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City. You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote. Grace and Peace, Pastor William E. Salmon 744 So. 10th Salina, KS 67401 wsalmon@cox.net<mailto:wsalmon@cox.net> _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net<mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Historical perspective: After Andrew Jackson’s election (similar level of frustrations), he was responsible for the actions leading to the genocidal ‘Trail of Tears’ and ‘Trail of Death.’ He refused to accept the Supreme Court’s finding that the expulsions were unconstitutional. And the republic survived. But many Native Americans didn’t. This great experiment has its dark side in the governmental support of the KKK following Reconstruction, another act of populism. We aren’t pure, we haven’t avoided evil in the past and likely won’t in the future. But we’re still here. We’re still struggling with the incredible level of power in our hands, and do great damage even when we intend great good. Our greatest danger is believing that there is a wish dream worth idealizing rather than realities to address. Bill From: OE [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Susan Fertig via OE Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 11:16 AM To: Judi White Cc: Order Ecumenical Community Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Salmon: Clinton's relationship to E.I. - Dear Susan Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a criminal--her vision for the country is my first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. Both of them scare me to death. But neither if the other candidates is really an option either. I fear we're about to see this great American experiment in democracy become something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world. Susan Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White <sophiacircle@gmail.com> wrote: Well, what you wrote is what Frumper repeats over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him. I Personally prefer to read responses to a candidates vision for this nation. Also I stand firm in ny admiration which never ceases, of this woman who has continued in spite of the unbelievable accusations which are so blown up out of the real world of truth and honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?". Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid vision for this nation and this planet? There is no other candidate who shines so brightly and qualified to be an example for our children and grandchildren at this time. Rightly so. On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: How in the world did you infer that I must be a Trump supporter from my message? Susan Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com> wrote: Dear Susan, Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 16-year Order member, I am awed by your commitment to American Republicanism and conservative Christianity. How in the world did you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA community and have your world view remain unaffected?
From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% supporters of HRC and the image of America she represents. Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald.
Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read about that is attributed to Hillary has been most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations. Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, parochial narcissist and most of all a climate change denier? HRC is none of the above. Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet. Your phrase: "only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump. I would invite you to see all that as a projection. Should Trump take ownership of any of the above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree? Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, literary critic, essayist, and environmental activist) describes America in the midst of a Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women. While there are indeed my contradictions in American society that both the Republican and Democratic administrations must answer for, the attached article came closest - for me - in describing how the Republican voice has committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’. Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all Trump supporters who have been left without any vision other than rebellion or depression. We are all responsible. Everyone. Ken in Canada. A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Values??? The only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary. I've heard for years about this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement. Susan Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Colleagues-- So many raise the question concerning Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I decided to cast this bread upon the waters. The first sign is that while I addressed it to Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped up. Consequently, it may really get to her attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid. Inner Peace, Bill Mrs. Hillary Clinton: It is my prayer that this reaches you concerning your experience in 5th City, Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been at a training event to become known as RS-I. About the same time, a large number of us dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement that grew from our experience in Chicago Ghetto to literally embrace the world. It makes me wonder if your experience under his leadership influenced the values you hold dear, and now wish to step onto the platform of the Presidency to do for our United States and for the world what was embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City. You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote. Grace and Peace, Pastor William E. Salmon 744 So. 10th Salina, KS 67401 wsalmon@cox.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net _______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
I keep asking, but still have not seen, one shred of verifiable evidence to substantiate the charge that Hillary has committed a criminal act of any sort. She's made serious mistakes like with the private server, she has not been as transparent as she could and perhaps should have been, she got paid a lot of money for some speeches (but less than some men), she's flip-flopped on some positions she's taken like on TPP, she has a super-healthy ego (an asset for a man but a huge liability for a woman in our culture), she didn't play nice when she was First Lady trying to get health care passed, as Secretary of State she traveled the world and spoke truth to power like the Premier of China, and after much gut-wrenching deliberation and prayer she chose to stay true to her vow to her husband of "for better or worse" through "worse." And to add insult to injury, she decided to run to be the first woman in the Office of President of the United States. How dare she. Despise her for all those things and hate all her positions on the issues, but don't accuse her of being a criminal unless you have some rock solid proof that hours and years and millions of dollars worth of hearings, investigations and witch hunts by scores of government agencies, news media and nondescript malcontents have been unable to produce. I've heard the rumors, innuendos, exaggerations, conjecture, gross distortions and outright lies, everything but verifiable truth. Got any? Then let's have it. But double check your sources before you put it out there because there really are some malingering, deplorable liars afoot in the land and a lot of fools are believing them and then repeating what they heard them say and calling it truth, and it just isn't. Randy Sent from my iPad
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:15 PM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a criminal--her vision for the country is my first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. Both of them scare me to death. But neither if the other candidates is really an option either. I fear we're about to see this great American experiment in democracy become something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world.
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White <sophiacircle@gmail.com> wrote: Well, what you wrote is what Frumper repeats over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him. I Personally prefer to read responses to a candidates vision for this nation. Also I stand firm in ny admiration which never ceases, of this woman who has continued in spite of the unbelievable accusations which are so blown up out of the real world of truth and honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?". Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid vision for this nation and this planet? There is no other candidate who shines so brightly and qualified to be an example for our children and grandchildren at this time. Rightly so.
On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: How in the world did you infer that I must be a Trump supporter from my message?
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Susan,
Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 16-year Order member, I am awed by your commitment to American Republicanism and conservative Christianity. How in the world did you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA community and have your world view remain unaffected?
From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% supporters of HRC and the image of America she represents. Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald.
Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read about that is attributed to Hillary has been most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations.
Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, parochial narcissist and most of all a climate change denier? HRC is none of the above. Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet.
Your phrase: "only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump.
I would invite you to see all that as a projection.
Should Trump take ownership of any of the above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree?
Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, literary critic, essayist, and environmental activist) describes America in the midst of a Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women.
While there are indeed my contradictions in American society that both the Republican and Democratic administrations must answer for, the attached article came closest - for me - in describing how the Republican voice has committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’.
Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all Trump supporters who have been left without any vision other than rebellion or depression.
We are all responsible. Everyone.
Ken in Canada.
A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Values??? The only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary. I've heard for years about this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement.
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Colleagues-- So many raise the question concerning Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I decided to cast this bread upon the waters. The first sign is that while I addressed it to Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped up. Consequently, it may really get to her attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid. Inner Peace, Bill
Mrs. Hillary Clinton: It is my prayer that this reaches you concerning your experience in 5th City, Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been at a training event to become known as RS-I. About the same time, a large number of us dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement that grew from our experience in Chicago Ghetto to literally embrace the world. It makes me wonder if your experience under his leadership influenced the values you hold dear, and now wish to step onto the platform of the Presidency to do for our United States and for the world what was embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City. You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote. Grace and Peace, Pastor William E. Salmon 744 So. 10th Salina, KS 67401 wsalmon@cox.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Well said, Randy!! On Nov 1, 2016 2:20 PM, "Randy Williams via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
I keep asking, but still have not seen, one shred of verifiable evidence to substantiate the charge that Hillary has committed a criminal act of any sort. She's made serious mistakes like with the private server, she has not been as transparent as she could and perhaps should have been, she got paid a lot of money for some speeches (but less than some men), she's flip-flopped on some positions she's taken like on TPP, she has a super-healthy ego (an asset for a man but a huge liability for a woman in our culture), she didn't play nice when she was First Lady trying to get health care passed, as Secretary of State she traveled the world and spoke truth to power like the Premier of China, and after much gut-wrenching deliberation and prayer she chose to stay true to her vow to her husband of "for better or worse" through "worse." And to add insult to injury, she decided to run to be the first woman in the Office of President of the United States. How dare she. Despise her for all those things and hate all her positions on the issues, but don't accuse her of being a criminal unless you have some rock solid proof that hours and years and millions of dollars worth of hearings, investigations and witch hunts by scores of government agencies, news media and nondescript malcontents have been unable to produce. I've heard the rumors, innuendos, exaggerations, conjecture, gross distortions and outright lies, everything but verifiable truth. Got any? Then let's have it. But double check your sources before you put it out there because there really are some malingering, deplorable liars afoot in the land and a lot of fools are believing them and then repeating what they heard them say and calling it truth, and it just isn't. Randy
Sent from my iPad
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:15 PM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a criminal--her vision for the country is my first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. Both of them scare me to death. But neither if the other candidates is really an option either. I fear we're about to see this great American experiment in democracy become something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world.
Susan
*Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid* On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White <sophiacircle@gmail.com> wrote:
Well, what you wrote is what Frumper repeats over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him. I Personally prefer to read responses to a candidates vision for this nation. Also I stand firm in ny admiration which never ceases, of this woman who has continued in spite of the unbelievable accusations which are so blown up out of the real world of truth and honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?". Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid vision for this nation and this planet? There is no other candidate who shines so brightly and qualified to be an example for our children and grandchildren at this time. Rightly so.
On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
How in the world did you infer that I must be a Trump supporter from my message?
Susan
*Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid* On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Susan,
Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 16-year Order member, I am awed by your commitment to American Republicanism and conservative Christianity. How in the world did you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA community and have your world view remain unaffected?
From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% supporters of HRC and the image of America she represents. Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald.
Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read about that is attributed to Hillary has been most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations.
Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, parochial narcissist and most of all a climate change denier? HRC is none of the above. Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet.
Your phrase: "only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump.
I would invite you to see all that as a projection.
Should Trump take ownership of any of the above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree?
Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, literary critic, essayist, and environmental activist) describes America in the midst of a Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women.
While there are indeed my contradictions in American society that both the Republican and Democratic administrations must answer for, the attached article came closest - for me - in describing how the Republican voice has committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’.
Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all Trump supporters who have been left without any vision other than rebellion or depression.
We are all responsible. Everyone.
Ken in Canada.
A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Values??? The only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary. I've heard for years about this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement.
Susan
*Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid* On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Colleagues-- So many raise the question concerning Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I decided to cast this bread upon the waters. The first sign is that while I addressed it to Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped up. Consequently, it may really get to her attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid. Inner Peace, Bill
Mrs. Hillary Clinton: It is my prayer that this reaches you concerning your experience in 5th City, Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been at a training event to become known as RS-I. About the same time, a large number of us dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement that grew from our experience in Chicago Ghetto to literally embrace the world. It makes me wonder if your experience under his leadership influenced the values you hold dear, and now wish to step onto the platform of the Presidency to do for our United States and for the world what was embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City. You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote. Grace and Peace, Pastor William E. Salmon 744 So. 10th Salina, KS 67401 wsalmon@cox.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
No one has said that better, Randy. You should put that on Facebook…so we can all copy your words. Priscilla Wilson
On Nov 1, 2016, at 2:35 PM, Joyce Sloan via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Well said, Randy!!
On Nov 1, 2016 2:20 PM, "Randy Williams via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote: I keep asking, but still have not seen, one shred of verifiable evidence to substantiate the charge that Hillary has committed a criminal act of any sort. She's made serious mistakes like with the private server, she has not been as transparent as she could and perhaps should have been, she got paid a lot of money for some speeches (but less than some men), she's flip-flopped on some positions she's taken like on TPP, she has a super-healthy ego (an asset for a man but a huge liability for a woman in our culture), she didn't play nice when she was First Lady trying to get health care passed, as Secretary of State she traveled the world and spoke truth to power like the Premier of China, and after much gut-wrenching deliberation and prayer she chose to stay true to her vow to her husband of "for better or worse" through "worse." And to add insult to injury, she decided to run to be the first woman in the Office of President of the United States. How dare she. Despise her for all those things and hate all her positions on the issues, but don't accuse her of being a criminal unless you have some rock solid proof that hours and years and millions of dollars worth of hearings, investigations and witch hunts by scores of government agencies, news media and nondescript malcontents have been unable to produce. I've heard the rumors, innuendos, exaggerations, conjecture, gross distortions and outright lies, everything but verifiable truth. Got any? Then let's have it. But double check your sources before you put it out there because there really are some malingering, deplorable liars afoot in the land and a lot of fools are believing them and then repeating what they heard them say and calling it truth, and it just isn't. Randy
Sent from my iPad
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:15 PM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote:
Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a criminal--her vision for the country is my first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. Both of them scare me to death. But neither if the other candidates is really an option either. I fear we're about to see this great American experiment in democracy become something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world.
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White <sophiacircle@gmail.com <mailto:sophiacircle@gmail.com>> wrote: Well, what you wrote is what Frumper repeats over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him. I Personally prefer to read responses to a candidates vision for this nation. Also I stand firm in ny admiration which never ceases, of this woman who has continued in spite of the unbelievable accusations which are so blown up out of the real world of truth and honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?". Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid vision for this nation and this planet? There is no other candidate who shines so brightly and qualified to be an example for our children and grandchildren at this time. Rightly so.
On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote: How in the world did you infer that I must be a Trump supporter from my message?
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com <mailto:kenfisher1942@gmail.com>> wrote:
Dear Susan,
Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 16-year Order member, I am awed by your commitment to American Republicanism and conservative Christianity. How in the world did you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA community and have your world view remain unaffected?
From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% supporters of HRC and the image of America she represents. Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald.
Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read about that is attributed to Hillary has been most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations.
Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, parochial narcissist and most of all a climate change denier? HRC is none of the above. Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet.
Your phrase: "only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump.
I would invite you to see all that as a projection.
Should Trump take ownership of any of the above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree?
Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, literary critic, essayist, and environmental activist) describes America in the midst of a Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women.
While there are indeed my contradictions in American society that both the Republican and Democratic administrations must answer for, the attached article came closest - for me - in describing how the Republican voice has committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’.
Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all Trump supporters who have been left without any vision other than rebellion or depression.
We are all responsible. Everyone.
Ken in Canada.
A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy <http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy>
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote:
Values??? The only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary. I've heard for years about this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement.
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>> wrote: Colleagues-- So many raise the question concerning Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I decided to cast this bread upon the waters. The first sign is that while I addressed it to Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped up. Consequently, it may really get to her attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid. Inner Peace, Bill
Mrs. Hillary Clinton: It is my prayer that this reaches you concerning your experience in 5th City, Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been at a training event to become known as RS-I. About the same time, a large number of us dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement that grew from our experience in Chicago Ghetto to literally embrace the world. It makes me wonder if your experience under his leadership influenced the values you hold dear, and now wish to step onto the platform of the Presidency to do for our United States and for the world what was embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City. You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote. Grace and Peace, Pastor William E. Salmon 744 So. 10th Salina, KS 67401 wsalmon@cox.net <mailto:wsalmon@cox.net>
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net>
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net>
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net>
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net <mailto:OE@lists.wedgeblade.net> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net <http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net>
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Wilson Priscilla H pris@teamtechpress.com www.teamtechpress.com follow me on: Facebook Twitter
Thankyou for this conversation, colleagues. I appreciate the Honesty, pain and fear expressed in depth,to give us outsiders some real hope. Thankyou all. In peace and love, Isobel Sent from my iPhone
On 2 Nov 2016, at 7:02 am, Wilson Priscilla H via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
No one has said that better, Randy. You should put that on Facebook…so we can all copy your words. Priscilla Wilson
On Nov 1, 2016, at 2:35 PM, Joyce Sloan via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Well said, Randy!!
On Nov 1, 2016 2:20 PM, "Randy Williams via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: I keep asking, but still have not seen, one shred of verifiable evidence to substantiate the charge that Hillary has committed a criminal act of any sort. She's made serious mistakes like with the private server, she has not been as transparent as she could and perhaps should have been, she got paid a lot of money for some speeches (but less than some men), she's flip-flopped on some positions she's taken like on TPP, she has a super-healthy ego (an asset for a man but a huge liability for a woman in our culture), she didn't play nice when she was First Lady trying to get health care passed, as Secretary of State she traveled the world and spoke truth to power like the Premier of China, and after much gut-wrenching deliberation and prayer she chose to stay true to her vow to her husband of "for better or worse" through "worse." And to add insult to injury, she decided to run to be the first woman in the Office of President of the United States. How dare she. Despise her for all those things and hate all her positions on the issues, but don't accuse her of being a criminal unless you have some rock solid proof that hours and years and millions of dollars worth of hearings, investigations and witch hunts by scores of government agencies, news media and nondescript malcontents have been unable to produce. I've heard the rumors, innuendos, exaggerations, conjecture, gross distortions and outright lies, everything but verifiable truth. Got any? Then let's have it. But double check your sources before you put it out there because there really are some malingering, deplorable liars afoot in the land and a lot of fools are believing them and then repeating what they heard them say and calling it truth, and it just isn't. Randy
Sent from my iPad
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:15 PM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a criminal--her vision for the country is my first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. Both of them scare me to death. But neither if the other candidates is really an option either. I fear we're about to see this great American experiment in democracy become something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world.
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White <sophiacircle@gmail.com> wrote: Well, what you wrote is what Frumper repeats over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him. I Personally prefer to read responses to a candidates vision for this nation. Also I stand firm in ny admiration which never ceases, of this woman who has continued in spite of the unbelievable accusations which are so blown up out of the real world of truth and honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?". Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid vision for this nation and this planet? There is no other candidate who shines so brightly and qualified to be an example for our children and grandchildren at this time. Rightly so.
On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: How in the world did you infer that I must be a Trump supporter from my message?
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Susan,
Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 16-year Order member, I am awed by your commitment to American Republicanism and conservative Christianity. How in the world did you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA community and have your world view remain unaffected?
From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% supporters of HRC and the image of America she represents. Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald.
Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read about that is attributed to Hillary has been most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations.
Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, parochial narcissist and most of all a climate change denier? HRC is none of the above. Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet.
Your phrase: "only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump.
I would invite you to see all that as a projection.
Should Trump take ownership of any of the above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree?
Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, literary critic, essayist, and environmental activist) describes America in the midst of a Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women.
While there are indeed my contradictions in American society that both the Republican and Democratic administrations must answer for, the attached article came closest - for me - in describing how the Republican voice has committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’.
Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all Trump supporters who have been left without any vision other than rebellion or depression.
We are all responsible. Everyone.
Ken in Canada.
A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy
On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Values??? The only values I see are abject greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent the law. She has done absolutely nothing to improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged yet claims she has in the face of all evidence to the contrary. I've heard for years about this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement.
Susan
Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote: Colleagues-- So many raise the question concerning Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I decided to cast this bread upon the waters. The first sign is that while I addressed it to Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped up. Consequently, it may really get to her attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid. Inner Peace, Bill
Mrs. Hillary Clinton: It is my prayer that this reaches you concerning your experience in 5th City, Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been at a training event to become known as RS-I. About the same time, a large number of us dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement that grew from our experience in Chicago Ghetto to literally embrace the world. It makes me wonder if your experience under his leadership influenced the values you hold dear, and now wish to step onto the platform of the Presidency to do for our United States and for the world what was embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City. You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote. Grace and Peace, Pastor William E. Salmon 744 So. 10th Salina, KS 67401 wsalmon@cox.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
Wilson Priscilla H pris@teamtechpress.com www.teamtechpress.com
follow me on: Facebook Twitter
_______________________________________________ OE mailing list OE@lists.wedgeblade.net http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
I traveled in the UK (visited Schrijens and Heckmans), The Netherlands (Utrecht summer school), Russia (our Russian friends), Poland (a pilgrimate of sorts to meet church-rlated colleagues) and the Baltic nations (a RoadScholar study tour) this summer. Burna taught in China, then joined me from Poland onward. All of the people with whom I had a intimate enough conversation to lighten up and get real asked about Trump. Their query was accompanied by the question: “Has American gone mad?” In the fray of the last year, it’s become clear to me that I have become what Europeans might call a “social democrat.” The countries and cultures that I admire most include the Scandinavian nations and Canada. I’d have to rummage around for the statistics that document well being and happiness for the others out there. I’m heading toward the observation that advanced societies around the world are generous with their citizens, especially to their poorer, ill, mentally disturbed, and criminal citizens. They provide education, health care, safety nets, rehabilitation, and other services that help people stay on their feet and well enough to evolve. They pay the price in high taxes, but they reap the benefit in levels of security, human and economic development, and happiness. The bottom line for me is pretty straight forward: which candidate shares my vision for a just and generous society that cares for 100% of its citizens and gives everyone an opportunity to grow, learn, and evolve? Bernie Sanders touched some of these value points, but seemed an unlikely candidate. Donald Trump would take us in exactly the wrong direction. Hillary Clinton, faults notwithstanding, might buy us time to head in the right direction—right defined as equal employent opportunity, comprehensive health care and education, and a safety net that doesn’t let anyone fall through the cracks. An instructive aside from a trip several years ago. When we crossed the border between Russia and Finland, we could palpably the psycho-social climate change. Burna and I felt relief. We relaxed. The countryside was suddenly neater, the train stations suddenly fresher, the cities suddenly newer, and the people overwhelmingly more helpful, more open, more responsive, and, it appeared to us both, happier. There was a lesson in this about what makes a society sustainably healthy. It’s complicated. America isn’t quite there yet, and this election will set the direction for quite a while. There is a world of hurt and painfully intractable contradictions. But I’ve experienced several societies whose shared vision I identify with and would really like to emulate. Sigh. David
On Nov 1, 2016, at 2:23 PM, Isobel Bishop via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Thankyou for this conversation, colleagues. I appreciate the Honesty, pain and fear expressed in depth,to give us outsiders some real hope. Thankyou all. In peace and love, Isobel
— "Mystery, possibility, and the power to choose" [read and share on David's blog—www.spiritjourneys.org] David Dunn 740 S Alton Way 9B Denver, CO 80247 720-314-5991 dmdunn1@gmail.com
participants (7)
-
Bill Schlesinger via OE -
David Dunn via OE
-
Isobel Bishop via OE
-
Joyce Sloan via OE
-
Randy Williams via OE
-
Susan Fertig via OE
-
Wilson Priscilla H via OE