Elizabeth Engleman
englewoman@verizon.net
4000 N Charles ST
Baltimore, MD 21218

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Schlesinger via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community' <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
Cc: Bill Schlesinger <w.schlesinger@pvida.net>
Sent: Mon, Aug 20, 2018 3:47 pm
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Penance is required

One of the key Calvinist doctrines helps here - total depravity. We’re all screwed up (want evidence?). So we’d better deal with it. Dealing with it means structures that provide checks and balances, open access points for comment and protection for those of lesser authority while holding accountability for performance in a verifiable system. We didn’t do great with all of that, so I guess that makes us pretty good at figuring out ways to fix messes. But all system (human institutions – remember) are based on unbelief. There is no final fix, but there are ways forward. Question is – the willingness to take on the potential of fracturing the system in doing so.

FWIW

Bill Schlesinger

Project Vida

3607 Rivera Avenue

El Paso, TX 79905

(915) 533-7057 ext. 207

www.pvida.net

From: OE [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Seth Longacre via OE
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2018 1:40 PM
To: Order Ecumenical Community
Cc: Seth Longacre
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Penance is required

and not all abusive priests are pedophiles. It’s also not just a structural issue, but a theological one as well. So many seriously screwed up ideas about sex and women believed by these men which, in their minds, justify what happened, or at least leave them not responsible. (e.g. the widely held belief in Evangelical circles that it is the role of women to control men’s uncontrollable sexual urges.)

Seth T. Longacre

Carlsbad, CA

"No one man can terrorize a whole nation unless we are all his accomplices” Edward R. Murrow

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On Aug 20, 2018, at 12:34 , Del Morrill via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

Unfortunately, marriage is not necessarily an answer to pedophilia. I have worked with too many clients who lived as children with pedophiliacs - fathers, grandfathers, uncles - all married!

-----Original Message-----
From: OE <oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net> On Behalf Of Sarah H. Buss via OE
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2018 9:33 AM
To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net; oe@wedgeblade.net
Cc: Sarah H. Buss <shbuss@mac.com>
Subject: [Oe List ...] Penance is required

A meditative thought:
If the Catholic Church is to survive, it must allow priests to marry (and women to be priests). That is it’s penance! Otherwise it will continue to be a magnet for pedophiles.
If victims demand it, perhaps this could be a part of their healing process. Others could join in support.
Whatever the Catholic Church’s response, it must be radical, structural, and more than empty words.
Prayers, prayers, and more prayers,
Sarah
Sent from my iPhone
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