Herman, I understand your point and understand how you come to it. And I appreciate your taking the time to continue the dialogue in a useful way.
There was a defining moment in 2008 when we elected our first African American President, and despite my concerns about his lack of experience and socialist leanings (and therefore my very reluctant vote for his opponent, whom I did not hold in high regard), I awoke the next morning with a feeling of delight that we had finally broken the race barrier (even if we have yet to break the gender barrier) to the highest office in the land, arguably in the world.
Four years later I am deeply disappointed in President Obama and even more deeply concerned that our country will never recover from his mismanagement. I fear that this country will soon be so impoverished and debt ridden that we will no longer be in a position to help any other country dig out from under dictatorship and economic hopelessness.
Neither party and no candidate is ever going to be perfect, or completely moral, or above reproach. But the rhetoric the past few election cycles has been beyond the pale. And I am so weary of the name calling and the propagation of wild stories and wilder interpretations—on both sides. I am sick unto death of all of it.
Susan
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 5:55 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
Okay, Susan,
What I am suggesting is that there is a turning point happening away from the Reagan years and perhaps away from the politics you favor. Just keep September 17 in mind and see if that is true.
There are values on both sides. Essentially the messages of the two conventions were “we are all in this together” and the other “be self-reliant and keep government small.” The latter point is valid, but it hides the fact that neither side has done that, entitlements grew enormously under Republican Presidents, more so under Bush than Obama. Even when Obama proposes savings, which you would expect Republicans to favor, they are distorted as destroying, in this example, Medicare.
No, I don’t mean what you mean by defining moment. I mean that what has come out on this video exposes a deep problem and one that people will turn away from. “We’re all in this together and be self-reliant and keep government small” are not really oppositional. But keep government small has to be taken in a certain way, because neither side is proposing a small government.
I guess what I am saying is that I think that September 17 ended a certain period in American political history. Both sides will have to adjust to it.
Herman
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Susan Fertig
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 5:12 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
Oh, I heartily agree that it is a turning point/defining moment, etc. Just that I think the current President is destroying the country, so I’m coming from a different perspective than yours.
Susan
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Herman Greene
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:33 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
I didn’t assume that everyone on the list was a Democrat.
There are those moments in history that are defining moments. I could be wrong Susan, but I think this is one of them. It is kind of the end of an era and so I sent the email as one commenatator’s (not my) statement of what has become evident. Take it for what it’s worth, but consider that this is a turning point in American politics and that the debate (the one that will never end) will now be carried out on a different basis.
I didn’t send the message as a Democratic commentary, but as news.
Herman
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of Susan Fertig
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:21 PM
To: 'Order Ecumenical Community'
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
First, I find it offensive that there is an assumption that everyone on the listserv is a Democrat or espouses that party’s platform. Look up the definition of “group think”.
Second, I find it offensive to perpetuate negatively distorted characterizations of one candidate (and I’ve often found that this listserv also perpetuates characterizations of others that are just as distorted through bias on perceived positives). That’s the Kool-aid part.
And yes, the Kool-aid analogy could be attributed to all of us, myself included, who participated fanatically in something called the Spirit Movement that came pretty close to being a cult. You’re right.
Susan
From: oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net [mailto:oe-bounces@lists.wedgeblade.net] On Behalf Of David Walters
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 1:05 PM
To: Order Ecumenical Community
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] A good reflection on Romney
Susan
You need to explain what our collegue Herman has said that has offended you.
As one who is retired, pay no federal income tax, plus in two months from today I will qualify for Medicare - I am proud to say that I am part of the 47% that Romney spewed so much contempt for in the video referenced in Herman's comment.
I didn't know that Herman was in the Kool-Aid business, although if Joe M athews was with us and still teaching RS-1, he certainly would be accused of such.
-David Walters
Just for the record, not everyone on this listserv has drunk your KoolAid, and I’m offended by your language in the message below and the one that succeeds it.
Susan
Jonathan Chait says the hidden camera video that went viral yesterday exposes Mitt Romney "as a far more sinister character than I had imagined. Here is the sneering plutocrat, fully in thrall to a series of pernicious myths that are at the heart of the mania that has seized his party. He believes that market incomes in the United States are a perfect reflection of merit. Far from seeing his own privileged upbringing as the private-school educated son of an auto executive-turned-governor as an obvious refutation of that belief, Romney cites his own life, preposterously, as a confirmation of it..."
"The revelations in this video come to me as a genuine shock. I have never hated Romney. I presumed his ideological makeover since he set out to run for president was largely phony, even if he was now committed to carry through with it, and to whatever extent he'd come to believe his own lines, he was oblivious or naļve about the damage he would inflict upon the poor, sick, and vulnerable. It seems unavoidable now to conclude that Romney's embrace of Paul Ryanism is born of actual contempt for the looters and moochers, a class war on behalf of his own class."
_____________________________________________
Herman Greene
2516 Winningham Drive
Chapel Hill, NC 27516
919-929-4116 (h)
919-624-0579 (c)
919-942-4358 (f)
Skype: hgreene-nc
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