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Today's Topics:
1. I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling
question yesterday (steve har via OE)
2. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (Ken Fisher via OE)
3. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (Sherwood Shankland via OE)
4. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (Sherwood Shankland via OE)
5. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (Jo Nelson via OE)
6. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (W. J. via OE)
7. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (via OE)
8. Re: I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a
compelling question yesterday (Randy Williams via OE)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2015 17:09:58 -0600
From: steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: "oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, ICA
<ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>, Steve Ediger <steveediger@gmail.com>
Subject: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked
a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID:
<CADiNvGTp1UMnf5hSDHpWRuaN3G9Z9t0OozTYufjqzsvftvZUAA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
As I heard it, he asked
Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question -
and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID
conversation, a spirit question?
Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at
Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's
cultural mythology and meaning making.
Does someone have a generous answer?
--
Steve Harrington
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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2015 19:59:28 -0500
From: Ken Fisher via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: Steve Harrington <stevehar11201@gmail.com>
Cc: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, ICA
<ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID: <ABA9A45F-28B7-47A6-B5B9-B4284907F8CD@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Me: ?Where did the art form methodology come from?
David McKlesky: ?Rudolf Bultman. This is his method of scriptural grounding.?
k
On Dec 10, 2015, at 6:09 PM, steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
As I heard it, he asked
Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
Does someone have a generous answer?
--
Steve Harrington
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2015 03:04:23 +0000 (UTC)
From: Sherwood Shankland via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com>
Cc: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, ICA
<ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID:
<814694938.899464.1449803063701.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
A few notes on "art-form" and ORID conversations...In the 60's and 70's the Ecumenical Institute and its faculty from the Faith and Life community at UT Austin, conducted conversation about the impact of works of art. Notably Picaso's Guernica - impressions of saturation bombing; and the film Requim for a Heavyweight staring Anthony Quinn as the washed up boxer who decides that even he can live his life... The focus of these two conversations was not to teach anything directly but rather to allow the participants of the RS-I (Religious Studies - I seminar) to experience their experience of the painting and the film. As pedegogs we were listening to the participants' responses for their theological views, which could guide us in guiding the following sessions of the 44 hour weekend course.
I'm not sure when we formulated the ORID format - Marylin Olyer should know :-) but I associate ORID with our formalizing of facilitator skills training courses and the manuals for Group Facilitation Methods (now ToP Facilitation Methods) and Participatory Strategic Planning (now ToP Strategic Planning). Personally I think that the earlier titles / branding "GFM" and "PSP" are much more self-descriptive and clearer for marketing purposes. I suppose we could use both: "ToP - Group Facilitation Methods"; and "ToP - Participatory Strategic Planning".
Happy Holidays to All.../ Sherwood (on the road facilitating workshop on agricultural development in Kazakhstan and Kyrgykstan...back home Dec 18th.)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Fisher via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: "Steve Harrington" <stevehar11201@gmail.com>
Cc: "Order Ecumenical Community" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, "ICA" <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Sent: Friday, December 11, 2015 6:59:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling question yesterday
Me: ?Where did the art form methodology come from?
David McKlesky: ?Rudolf Bultman. This is his method of scriptural grounding.?
k
On Dec 10, 2015, at 6:09 PM, steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
As I heard it, he asked
Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
Does someone have a generous answer?
--
Steve Harrington
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2015 03:19:08 +0000 (UTC)
From: Sherwood Shankland via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: steve har <stevehar11201@gmail.com>
Cc: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net, ICA <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID:
<2143072851.908100.1449803948033.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
And the spirit question...not a formal method that I know of, except as pedagogues we were trained to listen for a deeply rooted "spirit issue" that a group or an individual was struggling with and seek to address that issue and thereby hopefully the Mystery of Life might address that person deeply. A very fine line between trying to use our own observations and judgments as opposed to self-reflection and discovery on the participant's part.
There is also an additional method called the "Spirit Conversation" which essentially follows an ORID flow, but draws upon each persons personal experience rather than a common group experience (like watching a film together). So topics like "Tears" or "Water" or "Death and dying" might be the basis of a conversation...The image for the leader was like steering a conoe with gentle turns with the potential for a deep vortex or thundering waterfall to enter the path of the conversation as the group sees the depth of their own experience with the topic. Check Brian's book on Focused Conversation...maybe some clues there...or the ICA archives on "Spirit Conversations"
Cheers, Sherwood
----- Original Message -----
From: "steve har via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net, "ICA" <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>, "Steve Ediger" <steveediger@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 11, 2015 5:09:58 AM
Subject: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling question yesterday
from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
As I heard it, he asked
Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
Does someone have a generous answer?
--
Steve Harrington
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
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------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2015 22:20:38 -0500
From: Jo Nelson via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: steve har <stevehar11201@gmail.com>
Cc: "oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, ICA
<ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID: <34AA5B60-40A0-41C5-831E-E4D9EE87D150@ica-associates.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi, all,
Wayne did a comprehensive research project on where this all came from. I'm working on getting the book ready for publication. I'm swamped this week and next, but I might be able to extract some insight on this particular question when the work lets up a bit.
The book, by the way, has the tentative title of "Getting to the Bottom of ToP" (more catchy than "The Phenomenology behind ICA's Methods") and hopefully will be published by next summer.
Take care,
Jo
>From the mobile desk of
Jo Nelson
Please reply to jnelson@ica-associates.ca
> On Dec 10, 2015, at 6:09 PM, steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>
> from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
>
> As I heard it, he asked
> Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
>
> What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
>
> Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
> It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
>
> Does someone have a generous answer?
>
> --
> Steve Harrington
> _______________________________________________
> OE mailing list
> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2015 04:33:59 +0000 (UTC)
From: "W. J. via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: Jo Nelson <jnelson@ica-associates.ca>, steve har
<stevehar11201@gmail.com>
Cc: "oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, ICA
<ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID:
<2129871134.559104.1449808439427.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Simply put, the 'art form conversation' is the 4-level ORID method of individual depth encounter/structured group reflection around experiencing any art form: something created by artist(s) as a unique expression of human perception/vision/insight.Marshall
On Thursday, December 10, 2015 7:20 PM, Jo Nelson via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Hi, all,
Wayne did a comprehensive research project on where this all came from. I'm working on getting the book ready for publication. I'm swamped this week and next,? but I might be able to extract some insight on this particular question when the work lets up a bit.
The book, by the way, has the tentative title of "Getting to the Bottom of ToP" (more catchy than "The Phenomenology behind ICA's Methods") and hopefully will be published by next summer.
Take care,
Jo
>From the mobile desk of
Jo Nelson
Please reply to jnelson@ica-associates.ca
> On Dec 10, 2015, at 6:09 PM, steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>
> from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
>
> As I heard it, he asked
> Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
>
> What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
>
> Jan Sanders, I know,? was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
> It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
>
> Does someone have a generous answer?
>
> --
> Steve Harrington
> _______________________________________________
> OE mailing list
> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2015 01:03:49 -0500
From: via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: sherwoodshankland@comcast.net, kenfisher1942@gmail.com
Cc: oe@lists.wedgeblade.net, ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID: <1518fa364c8-4f64-6c3c@webprd-a10.mail.aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
In the mid-80's, Gene Marshall published a binder with different conversation and workshop methods spelled out, for use by House Churches. Think I still have my copy in the garage.
Jann McGuire
-----Original Message-----
From: Sherwood Shankland via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com>
Cc: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>; ICA <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Sent: Thu, Dec 10, 2015 7:04 pm
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling question yesterday
A few notes on "art-form" and ORID conversations...In the 60's and 70's the Ecumenical Institute and its faculty from the Faith and Life community at UT Austin, conducted conversation about the impact of works of art. Notably Picaso's Guernica - impressions of saturation bombing; and the film Requim for a Heavyweight staring Anthony Quinn as the washed up boxer who decides that even he can live his life... The focus of these two conversations was not to teach anything directly but rather to allow the participants of the RS-I (Religious Studies - I seminar) to experience their experience of the painting and the film. As pedegogs we were listening to the participants' responses for their theological views, which could guide us in guiding the following sessions of the 44 hour weekend course.
I'm not sure when we formulated the ORID format - Marylin Olyer should know :-) but I associate ORID with our formalizing of facilitator skills training courses and the manuals for Group Facilitation Methods (now ToP Facilitation Methods) and Participatory Strategic Planning (now ToP Strategic Planning). Personally I think that the earlier titles / branding "GFM" and "PSP" are much more self-descriptive and clearer for marketing purposes. I suppose we could use both: "ToP - Group Facilitation Methods"; and "ToP - Participatory Strategic Planning".
Happy Holidays to All.../ Sherwood (on the road facilitating workshop on agricultural development in Kazakhstan and Kyrgykstan...back home Dec 18th.)
From: "Ken Fisher via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: "Steve Harrington" <stevehar11201@gmail.com>
Cc: "Order Ecumenical Community" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, "ICA" <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
Sent: Friday, December 11, 2015 6:59:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling question yesterday
Me: ?Where did the art form methodology come from?
David McKlesky: ?Rudolf Bultman. This is his method of scriptural grounding.?
k
On Dec 10, 2015, at 6:09 PM, steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
As I heard it, he asked
Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
Does someone have a generous answer?
--
Steve Harrington
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
_______________________________________________
OE mailing list
OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
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------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2015 06:42:34 -0600
From: Randy Williams via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: laurelcg@aol.com
Cc: ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com, oe@lists.wedgeblade.net
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger
asked a compelling question yesterday
Message-ID: <4F624B44-1D3C-4968-9625-7BA588C42181@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
The art form has a lot of similarity to Dietrich Bonhoeffer's process for making responsible decisions: observe, judge, weigh-up, decide, act
Randy
Sent from my iPad
> On Dec 11, 2015, at 12:03 AM, via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>
> In the mid-80's, Gene Marshall published a binder with different conversation and workshop methods spelled out, for use by House Churches. Think I still have my copy in the garage.
>
> Jann McGuire
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sherwood Shankland via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
> To: Ken Fisher <kenfisher1942@gmail.com>
> Cc: Order Ecumenical Community <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>; ICA <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
> Sent: Thu, Dec 10, 2015 7:04 pm
> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling question yesterday
>
> A few notes on "art-form" and ORID conversations...In the 60's and 70's the Ecumenical Institute and its faculty from the Faith and Life community at UT Austin, conducted conversation about the impact of works of art. Notably Picaso's Guernica - impressions of saturation bombing; and the film Requim for a Heavyweight staring Anthony Quinn as the washed up boxer who decides that even he can live his life... The focus of these two conversations was not to teach anything directly but rather to allow the participants of the RS-I (Religious Studies - I seminar) to experience their experience of the painting and the film. As pedegogs we were listening to the participants' responses for their theological views, which could guide us in guiding the following sessions of the 44 hour weekend course.
>
> I'm not sure when we formulated the ORID format - Marylin Olyer should know :-) but I associate ORID with our formalizing of facilitator skills training courses and the manuals for Group Facilitation Methods (now ToP Facilitation Methods) and Participatory Strategic Planning (now ToP Strategic Planning). Personally I think that the earlier titles / branding "GFM" and "PSP" are much more self-descriptive and clearer for marketing purposes. I suppose we could use both: "ToP - Group Facilitation Methods"; and "ToP - Participatory Strategic Planning".
>
> Happy Holidays to All.../ Sherwood (on the road facilitating workshop on agricultural development in Kazakhstan and Kyrgykstan...back home Dec 18th.)
>
>
> From: "Ken Fisher via OE" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>
> To: "Steve Harrington" <stevehar11201@gmail.com>
> Cc: "Order Ecumenical Community" <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net>, "ICA" <ica-dialogue@igc.topica.com>
> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2015 6:59:28 AM
> Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] I heard it on the grapevine, Steve Ediger asked a compelling question yesterday
>
>
>
>
>
> Me: ?Where did the art form methodology come from?
>
> David McKlesky: ?Rudolf Bultman. This is his method of scriptural grounding.?
>
>
> k
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Dec 10, 2015, at 6:09 PM, steve har via OE <oe@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>
> from the point of view of Imaginal Education and Imaginal Learning.
>
> As I heard it, he asked
> Is there a difference between an Art Form Conversation and ORID question - and- someone just mentioned a "spirit question".
>
> What is the difference between an art form conversation, an ORID conversation, a spirit question?
>
> Jan Sanders, I know, was recently asked by her teachers and principles at Aruba University why the conversation was called "art form" conversation.
> It sent her looking back into Brian Stanfield's work and Susan Langer's cultural mythology and meaning making.
>
> Does someone have a generous answer?
>
> --
> Steve Harrington
> _______________________________________________
> OE mailing list
> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> OE mailing list
> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> OE mailing list
> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
> _______________________________________________
> OE mailing list
> OE@lists.wedgeblade.net
> http://lists.wedgeblade.net/listinfo.cgi/oe-wedgeblade.net
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