“…the long work
of turning their lives
into a celebration
is not easy. Come and let us talk“.
The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
On Apr 12, 2025, at 1:40 AM, rev.bud@mac.com wrote:
I had assumed that the claim of encountering another world had been a valid claim. Having read recently a couple books by Lesslie Newbigin (Foolishness to the Greeks and The Gospel in a Pluralist Society) it has made me wonder whether that claim is valid. Newbigin raises the question"how can we move from the place where we explain the gospel in terms of our modern scientific world - view to the place where we explain our modern scientific world - view from the point of view of the gospel ?”David Kettle in a book based on Newbigin’s thinking, “Western Culture in a Gospel Context” states even more clearly the difficulty of not having our religion thinking subverted by Western values writing:"When the Western individual is converted to Christ, this is at once a conversion of them from their culture and a conversion within them of their culture. This paradox lies at the heart of this book, in relation to the cultural context of “the West.”
For Western Christians this invites reflection both upon their own culture and upon their own faith: are they converted faithfully from Western culture, and is Western culture properly converted within them? Or is it rather the case that, unawares, their faith is domesticated to Western culture? Are they unable to see this culture, and their domestication to it, for what they are in the light of Christ?
Introducing my topic, I shall first recall what it means to be converted to Christ. For a start, if we profess faith in Christ this does not, in itself, show we are converted: professing Christians may in practice refuse to be responsive to God and allow God to change the way they think, behave, and feel—their whole way of seeing others, themselves, and the world—in ways that God desires. As part of this, they may remain or become captive to cultural beliefs, passions, and worldviews at odds with conversion to Christ. The temptation of cultural captivity to modern Western culture is pervasive among professing Christians in the West today. This, of course, subverts authentic mission."
How is the claim of "encountering another world” related to the Gospel?Grace and peace,Bud TillinghastOakland GalaxyOn 11 Apr 2025, at 23:39, James Wiegel via Dialogue <dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:1. Did we actually encounter / (re)discover the other world incthe midst of this world (the realities of mystery, consciousness, care and tranquillity as present in our lives and world) or did we just say that??_______________________________________________2. See below the words for “The Mystery is Everywhere”. Do any of you have a recording of it being sung? I can hear Mary Warren Moffett singing it in my head .ThanksJim Wiegel“…the long work
of turning their lives
into a celebration
is not easy. Come and let us talk“.The Sunflowers. Mary Oliver
Begin forwarded message:From: James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com>
Date: April 11, 2025 at 2:13:37 PM MST
To: jfwiegel@yahoo.com
Subject: help
Reply-To: James Wiegel <jfwiegel@yahoo.com>THE MYST'RY IS EVERYWHERE
Tune: Desert Song
The Myst'ry is everywhere: I'm trapped in awe for e'er and e'er!
And I must roam through life with all its care, grasping nought for certain except my dying.
Why should I so driven be to bear with such absurdity?
Still I shall die yearning, lost in the wonder of mystery.
The Myst'ry is everywhere: I'll ne’er escape its awful stare!
Destroyed, unveiled, within a searing glare, doomed to live transparent within my dying.
Why am I condemned to see the pow'r of this finality?
Still I shall die yearning, lost in the wonder of mystery.
The Myst'ry is everywhere: and changes all beyond compare.
It runs to breathe surprise into the air and I find a strange new life in my dying.
Why should I the chosen be to dance with this vitality?
Still I shall die yearning, lost in the wonder of mystery.
The Myst'ry is everywhere: yet I must doubt this one so fair,
For none can ever know its secrets rare and I'll ever be lonely in my dying.
Why's this awful love in me become my sole reality?
Still I shall die yearning, lost in the wonder of mystery.
Jim WiegelThe unknown is what is. And to be frightened of it is what sends everybody scurrying around chasing dreams, illusions, wars, peace, love, hate, all that. Unknown is what is. Accept that it's unknown, and it's plain sailing. John Lennon
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