<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:24px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1441036990336_9418"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1441036990336_9907">Maybe we should write and publish on 'The Conservative Right-Wing Heresies' (note: they are plural). Starting with Fox [so-called] News.</span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1441036990336_9418" dir="ltr">There could be a interesting correspondence with some 'Liberal Heresy' points. But I note that 'The Liberal Heresy' was addressed to 'us', not to 'them'. In other words, separating the liberal cop-outs from the radical revolutionaries who dare(d) to Do Something (however puny or mistargeted) based on vision/contradiction analysis/proposals/strategy/tactics/implementaries--instead of Doing Nothing.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1441036990336_9418" dir="ltr">Marshall</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1441036990336_9418" dir="ltr"><br></div> <br><div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" style="display: block;"> <div style="font-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif; font-size: 24px;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> On Monday, August 31, 2015 8:18 AM, John P Cock via Dialogue <dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:<br> </font> </div> <br><br> <div class="y_msg_container"><div id="yiv4101034016"><div><div>Does the liberal heresy apply only to our treatment of humans?</div><div><br clear="none"></div><span id="yiv4101034016OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"></span><div class="yiv4101034016yqt5193659027" id="yiv4101034016yqtfd40714"><div style="font-family:Calibri;font-size:11pt;text-align:left;color:black;BORDER-BOTTOM:medium none;BORDER-LEFT:medium none;PADDING-BOTTOM:0in;PADDING-LEFT:0in;PADDING-RIGHT:0in;BORDER-TOP:#b5c4df 1pt solid;BORDER-RIGHT:medium none;PADDING-TOP:3pt;"><span style="font-weight:bold;">From: </span> Randy Williams via Dialogue <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net">dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>><br clear="none"><span style="font-weight:bold;">Reply-To: </span> Randy Williams <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:randycw1938@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:randycw1938@gmail.com">randycw1938@gmail.com</a>><br clear="none"><span style="font-weight:bold;">Date: </span> Monday, August 31, 2015 at 10:55 AM<br clear="none"><span style="font-weight:bold;">To: </span> "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:KarenBueno@aol.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:KarenBueno@aol.com">KarenBueno@aol.com</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:KarenBueno@aol.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:KarenBueno@aol.com">KarenBueno@aol.com</a>><br clear="none"><span style="font-weight:bold;">Cc: </span> "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net">oe@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net">oe@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>>, "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net">dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net">dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>><br clear="none"><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject: </span> Re: [Dialogue] [Oe List ...] Breakfast News Conversations...<br clear="none"></div><div><br clear="none"></div><div></div></div></div><div class="yiv4101034016yqt5193659027" id="yiv4101034016yqtfd51978"><div><div><div>Kind of depends on whether we see ourselves more as an independent national community with a mob at our gates, a kind of "we and them" mentality, or we see an interdependent global community where we're all in it together. IMHO, it's all in the story we tell ourselves. </div><div>Randy<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Sent from my iPad<div><br clear="none"></div></div><div><br clear="none">On Aug 31, 2015, at 9:24 AM, Karenbueno <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:karenbueno@aol.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:karenbueno@aol.com">karenbueno@aol.com</a>> wrote:<br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><font color="black" size="2" face="arial"></font><div><font face="Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif" style="background-color:transparent;">Good point, Randy. I think the "liberal heresy" today would be that the United States is called to fully accept all immigrants, without conditions. The Trump plan to deport all who are undocumented is the opposite. What might be the "orthodox" belief.</font></div><div> </div><div>Karen (Wright) Bueno</div><div> </div><div> </div><div style="color:black;font-family:arial, helvetica;font-size:10pt;">-----Original Message-----<br clear="none">
From: Randy Williams via OE <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net">oe@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>><br clear="none">
To: Frank Knutson <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:f.knutson@earthlink.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:f.knutson@earthlink.net">f.knutson@earthlink.net</a>><br clear="none">
Cc: Order Ecumenical ICA-USA <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net">oe@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>>; Order Ecumenical ICA-USA <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net">dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>><br clear="none">
Sent: Mon, Aug 31, 2015 6:57 am<br clear="none">
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] [Dialogue] Breakfast News Conversations...<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div id="yiv4101034016AOLMsgPart_1.2_73473bc8-9cca-439b-a3f8-ff2077aba54b"><div class="yiv4101034016aolReplacedBody">
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Regarding the liberal heresy, one of the learnings I remember from the study of this paper is that in formulating some of the early creeds of the church, heresy was not a perversion of orthodoxy, but instead heresy preceded and gave rise to orthodoxy. Someone would come forth with a doctrine or tenet or whatever and the establishment would say, "well that's not correct, that's not what we believe." In the process they would be forced to formulate what they did believe, which often would then become the orthodox position. Seen in this light, heresy actually is a contributing factor, the motivation behind the church getting clarity on where it stood. Not sure what we would point to in the social realm as heresy today, but it seems possible that, whatever it is, it could play that same role of forcing us to clarify our own position.
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Randy
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Sent from my iPad
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On Aug 25, 2015, at 12:59 PM, Frank Knutson via OE <
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Enclosed: THE LIBERAL HERESY \
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I think it was given by John Epps or maybe Gene Marshall????
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<THE LIBERAL HERESY.docx>
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<b style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);text-transform:none;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;"><span style="color:teal;font-family:Tahoma;"><br clear="none" class="yiv4101034016Apple-interchange-newline">"What appears to be a breaking down of civilization<span class="yiv4101034016Apple-converted-space"> </span><br clear="none">
may well be simply the breaking up of old forms by life itself."</span></b> <b style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);text-transform:none;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;"><span style="color:teal;font-family:'Minion Pro Bold';font-size:14pt;"><span class="yiv4101034016Apple-converted-space"> </span><br clear="none">
~<span class="yiv4101034016Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b>
<span style="font:14px/normal Tahoma;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);text-transform:none;text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;word-spacing:0px;white-space:normal;">Joyce Carol Oates</span>
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<font color="#ff2600" style="font:14px/normal;"><span style="font-size:18px;">❤</span> </font>
<font color="#0433ff" style="font:14px/normal;"><font size="4">Frank</font> </font>
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On Aug 25, 2015, at 8:39 AM, Rod Rippel via Dialogue <
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net">dialogue@lists.wedgeblade.net</a>> wrote:
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Fascists and dictators (and now just about everyone) have long understood that
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deviant behavior is encouraged by the fact that the media give it coverage. <br clear="none">
For example it used to be, "Don't write about suicide" because the mere
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mention of suicide might inspire someone to commit suicide in the next few days.
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Now we are flooded with all kinds of deviant inspiration. We live in a time of
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internet, Facebook, Twitter and adultery matchup-services.
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Like the phrase sometimes used in the RS-1 'Freedom Lecture,' "All Is Known,"
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literally! The inundation of 'information' has either swamped us with stress and
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physical reaction or prompted a new level of defensive withdrawal from engaging.
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Scriptural wisdom and "Deciding" goes by the board!
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-----Original Message----- From: steve har via OE
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Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2015 6:06 AM
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To:
<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:oe@lists.wedgeblade.net">oe@lists.wedgeblade.net</a> ; Order Ecumenical ICA-USA
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Subject: [Oe List ...] Breakfast News Conversations...
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Also called scripture/news conversations
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You remember them right?
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random bits of recalled news and then a piece of scriptural wisdom
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what to do about it?
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These days news like trying to "drink from a fire hose"
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My experience now living in the USfA now rather than Costa Rica and
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listening to USA media is curious.
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Feels to me like a case of news culture ADHD where nothing is
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connected to anything except by more and more crisis news events, more
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passionate & positional thinking more economic political and cultural
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and more and more "news journalists" driving to their bank on the
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stream of news.
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My friend Jack Gilles, if I quote him right, says ORID conversations
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no longer have a "D" now because it it is all interpretation, everyone
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has an opinion, everyone is a spectator stuck in the stands watching
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an unplayable game.
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Now in conversations is no "D" in ORID, no one knows how to Decide or what Do.
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"D" stands for Dumpster or "Don't decide" or "Despair" or just "Done".
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Joe Mathews had a paper, I believe, which he called the liberal <br clear="none">
heresy - aybe it was the conservative heresy or the reactionary
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heresy.
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He used some fancy theological terminology like "the immediacy of the <br clear="none">
eschaton" which I never did understand,exactly.
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Anyone remember this paper?
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Wondering where IS the scripture part, the wisdom part of the
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breakfast news conversation?
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The Christian Science Monitor says THEY are doing two things...As days
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and weeks pass, the media move on to new stories, often neglecting to
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tell the “what’s possible?” stories about how the people and
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communities affected by these tragedies are coping and what they’re
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learning. We hear these types of stories on one-year anniversaries,
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but they’re not an ongoing part of the media’s coverage the way that
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the “what happened?” stories are. A growing body of research is <br clear="none">
confirming what many have long suspected — that a steady diet of
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trauma and disaster triggers stress, fear and trauma in those
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consuming the stories.
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What if the news media covered stories of recovery and resilience as
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much as they cover stories about devastation and despair?
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<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://ivoh.org/restorativenarrative/">http://ivoh.org/restorativenarrative/</a>
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Steve
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--
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Steve
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