[Oe List ...] Comparing our federal government and the Roman Catholic Church . . .

Fri Oct 24 11:25:52 PDT 2025

Thanks, Randy, for your reply -- a couple of additional notions came to my mind as I read your reply.  See below interweaved with your reflections.
THE HONORABLE GENTLEMAN FROM FLORIDA:  James, that’s an interesting thought. Partisanship and divided loyalties seem to me to be what thwarts the ability of the Congress to fulfill its legislative responsibilities of which passing a budget is the largest piece. Whereas politics plays a part in the deliberations of the Conclave, they are not primarily a political body as Congress is. 
JIM:  I think that Congress is not a political body, they are elected to GOVERN, not politic.  To me, the every 2 year, 4 year and 6 year election cycles were meant to be a BRIEF political season after which we have chosen those who will represent us in GOVERNING.  I guess constant campaigning and politicking is more emotionally stimulating (and more "dramatic" and less expensive to report on as news) than the dreary business of working out details and actual solutions to challenges we face, taking action, seeing the consequences in implementation and having to adjust.
 THE HONORABLE GENTLEMAN FROM FLORIDA:  My guess is they overcome their ideological differences because they have a common loyalty. Whereas each member of Congress promises loyalty to the Constitution, that tends to get misplaced as loyalty to the party, president or their constituency, 
JIM:  and their funders and the flood of lobbyists and opionionists surrounding them.  I think that is the wisdom of sequestering the Cardinals -- they carry the voices of their constituents in their heads, but in the conclave they are isolated with only the other folks designated to making the decision vs. the constant chattering and nanner nannering they would face without the seclusion.
 THE HONORABLE GENTLEMAN FROM FLORIDA:  all toward the goal of being re-elected for as long as they want. So their bottom line is job security, which is not a primary concern for the cardinals. Maybe if Congress were not paid during a shutdown that would add some impetus. Even without shutting the government down they usually do a “continuing resolution” in place of an annual budget. Maybe democracy is supposed to be messy, but the system as it is seems to come up short in both efficiency and effectiveness. There are some steps that perhaps could moderate that a little, like term limits for a start.
JIM:  AND MAYBE BOTH THE MEMBERS OF THE HOUSE AND OF THE SENATE SHOULD BE SEATED IN ALPHABETICAL ORDER BY NAME OR BY STATE-- OR MAYBE COUNT OFF FROM TIME TO TIME TO DIFFERENT SMALL GROUPS TO FIGURE OUT WHAT TO DO.  I quake to think what it would be like to have to facilitate a group doggedly seated next to those who already agree with them . . .
Randy

Jim Wiegel  

Theunknown is what is.  And to be frightened of it is what sends everybodyscurrying around chasing dreams, illusions, wars, peace, love, hate, allthat.  Unknown is what is.  Accept that it's unknown, and it's plainsailing.    John Lennon

401 North Beverly Way, Tolleson, Arizona 85353
623-363-3277

jfwiegel at yahoo.com

www.partnersinparticipation.com

    On Friday, October 24, 2025 at 05:15:37 AM MST, Randy Williams <randycw1938 at gmail.com> wrote:  

 James, that’s an interesting thought. Partisanship and divided loyalties seem to me to be what thwarts the ability of the Congress to fulfill its legislative responsibilities of which passing a budget is the largest piece. Whereas politics plays a part in the deliberations of the Conclave, they are not primarily a political body as Congress is. My guess is they overcome their ideological differences because they have a common loyalty. Whereas each member of Congress promises loyalty to the Constitution, that tends to get misplaced as loyalty to the party, president or their constituency, all toward the goal of being re-elected for as long as they want. So their bottom line is job security, which is not a primary concern for the cardinals. Maybe if Congress were not paid during a shutdown that would add some impetus. Even without shutting the government down they usually do a “continuing resolution” in place of an annual budget. Maybe democracy is supposed to be messy, but the system as it is seems to come up short in both efficiency and effectiveness. There are some steps that perhaps could moderate that a little, like term limits for a start.Randy
On Oct 23, 2025, at 7:01 PM, James Wiegel via OE <oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:

This is just a strange thought that came to me this morning as I was listening to news reports of the many Federal workers who are lining up at food banks, etc. in anticipation of not receiving their paychecks tomorrow.  Why are they (and the rest of us) paying for the "government shut down"?
 ACCORDINGTO GOOGLE: Congress's main role is to make laws, control taxingand spending, and provide a system of checks and balances within theU.S. government. The Constitution grants it powers such as declaringwar, regulating commerce, coining money, and overseeing the executivebranch through hearings and an oversight function. The legislativeprocess involves both the House of Representatives and the Senate,with specific powers, like the Senate's "advice and consent"for presidential appointments and treaties,. 
Corefunctions of Congress

   -    
 Lawmaking: To make laws that affect all Americans, based on debate and the legislative process involving both the House and Senate.

   -    
 Financial control: To raise revenue through taxes, approve the federal budget, and coin money.

   -    
 War declaration: To have the sole authority to declare war.

   -    
 Oversight: To oversee the executive branch and ensure that laws are administered according to congressional intent through hearings and investigations. 

Weelect 535 people to Congress. They have not done their job – WORKTOGETHER to, in this instance, approve the federal budget (in atimely manner). Federal workers who are furloughed or not being paidare paying the price for their paralysis. More and more, we thepeople are also paying the price, and the nation as a whole as otherslook at us with increasing disdain. Why are the REST OF US payingthe price for the DECISION of those 535 members to not do their job??

Iwas thinking about the Roman church and the recent necessity to namea new Pope. (also the movie, was it "Conclave"?  The people responsible for that decision weresequestered in a room with no contact outside until they came to adecision. No time off, no “man-splaining”, no tweets, no pressconferences. Just one thing – come to a decision they will alllive with. And stay there til you do.  Hence the white smoke.

Maybewe should try this. Sequester all 535 till they come to the decisionthey are charged with making on our behalf. Then let us know and wemove on. Perhaps a fine for each day they are interrupting our livesby their incapacity to do their job. Or perhaps a % reduction intheir salaries, expenses, benefits and retirement each day for the troublethey are causing the rest of us by their choosing not to do the jobwe elected them to. 

Jim Wiegel  

Theunknown is what is.  And to be frightened of it is what sends everybodyscurrying around chasing dreams, illusions, wars, peace, love, hate, allthat.  Unknown is what is.  Accept that it's unknown, and it's plainsailing.    John Lennon

401 North Beverly Way, Tolleson, Arizona 85353
623-363-3277

jfwiegel at yahoo.com

www.partnersinparticipation.com
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