[Oe List ...] OE Digest, Vol 163, Issue 6

Tue Oct 7 00:03:42 PDT 2025

 In case you missed it: it's an invasion.https://www.nytimes.com/2025/10/06/us/fear-ice-chicago.html?unlocked_article_code=1.rk8.caiF.umbJrnB8dG0l&smid=url-share
Marshall
    On Monday, October 6, 2025 at 06:42:45 PM PDT, Susan Fertig via OE <oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:  

Larry, I respect your points.

My concern is based on:

   - the hordes of people tearing down the barricades put up to keep them out in the Biden Administration
   - the numbers of violent criminals and not so violent criminals that make it difficult to discern who is and who isn’t
   - the sheer volume of trafficked individuals who were victimized by those “importing” them into our country
   - the number of lost, unaccompanied children who have never been recovered and who should be sent back to their parents

My lack of concern is based on:

   - how is it that people who entered our country illegally have any rights--due process or other?
   - How is it that we are not worried about ICE officers being identified when the hordes of violent protesters and those who openly threaten ICE wear masks routinely?

I do take issue with your assertion that “No matter how many white men go on killing sprees in the US we are not singled out…”

I would state that ”No matter how many black or brown or white men…”

The people that are singled out are not American citizens.

I often find Trump’s rhetoric offensive. I often find he overstates for effect, which I don’t condone. I often find him bragging, which I abhor.

That said, I support him as President—God is big enough that He can use anybody, no matter how flawed, for His purposes.

I often find the rhetoric used against the “other side” abhorrent as well—to talk of openly supporting killing anyone who doesn’t agree with them or suggests an idea that is different is horrible.

Susan

Susan Fertig-Dykes

And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought .  Isaiah 58:11

From: OE <oe-bounces at lists.wedgeblade.net>On Behalf Of Lawrence Philbrook via OE
Sent: Monday, October 06, 2025 9:18 PM
To: oe at lists.wedgeblade.net
Cc: Lawrence Philbrook <icalarry at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] OE Digest, Vol 163, Issue 6

Susan you raise a valid question

The ICE challenge in America and the ICA response, what is the frame of reference?  

Yes there is broad agreement that too many illegal and unvetted immigrants were allowed into the US.  Especially those who committed crimes in their own country and in the US.  These people are officially the publicized target of the ICE raids.   However Current numbers - 42,755 out of 59,762—or 71.5% held in ICE detention have no criminal conviction according to data current as of September 21, 2025.

ICE has responsibility to apprehend and return people who are in the US illegally.  They have a difficult and sometimes dangerous job.  It has been made more complicated by the political climate and expectations placed on them by consecutive administrations.  Their legal status can literally change day to day based on the administration withdrawing legal status that had been given earlier. The current administration does these changes overnight making it very difficult for the “illegals” to know they are illegal.  This can affect hundreds of thousands of people with each decision.

The manner in which they implement their job is in question

   - Do they follow due process laws which are required in our country whether you are a citizen or not
   - Do they appear masked, weapons drawn and without warrants 
   - Do they only stop and arrest illegal immigrants (the worst of the worst criminals) or stop and hold all people who speak Spanish and look like they are immigrants or are at places where “illegals” look for employment to make sure they have caught and deported enough people for their quota.
   - The consequence being American Citizens and legal immigrants being handcuffed and held hours or days - disrupting their lives especially those who live paycheck to paycheck simply to make the officers catching process simpler. 
   - Their leadership is not making it easier to believe they are not intentionally harassing American citizens who “fit the description"
   - American citizens who are children are being deported without due process or a care structure.

As an old white American Male I can not imagine this happening to me.  No matter how many white men go on killing sprees in the US we are not singled out as an issue.  

Evelyn being Japanese American has family history about the US sending troops to round them up and send them to camps.  

ICE and the republican politicians bragging about The Aligator Alcatraz with most of the people inside being  without any other criminal actions, does not stimulate trust in the system.

Am I missing something that you are seeing that is different than the above?

With respect,

Larry

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