[Oe List ...] Salmon: Clinton's relationship to E.I. -Dear Susan

[Adam Thomson via OE]

 From Adam Thomson, Dover in the UK,

As one who originally consciously and physically 
joined the Spirit Movement in 1972, I have been 
stimulated by the responses in this stream - 
especially from Jaime, Dharma and Randy.

I was also negatively stimulated by Susan 
Fertig's comments concerning HRC, and applauded Randy's posting on that.

I had been struck by Susan's comments that 
revealingly included, "I've heard for years about 
this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly 
hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement."

I have to say that Sue Fertig - even after many 
years - still has not grasped what the "movement" 
is about, at least in part: as the Spirit 
Movement - as the forgiven ones - we are not 
"embarrassed" by the actions or otherwise of 
anyone allegedly or otherwise connected with it.

As it happens, I am still smarting from Susan's 
outrageous comments, including alleging that HRC was a criminal.

And then, last night (Wednesday) in the UK, I 
happened to see Michael Moore's most recent short 
film, "Michael Moore in Trumpland", which cheered me up no end.

I STRONGLY recommend people see this. Michael 
Moore was filmed doing a one-hour stand-up 
routine in Wilmington OH before an audience of 
committed HRC-haters, and the result was 
fascinating. Michael certainly put HRC's alleged 
past into a perspective that was helpful to me.

By the way - our daughter Mary (born July 4 1978 
at Weiss Memorial Hospital in Chicago) has taken 
great pains to exert her right to a VOTE as a US 
citizen (for the first time!), and she posted off 
her absentee ballot yesterday. I'm not telling anybody how she voted...

Do try and see "Michael Moore in Trumpland", 
ASAP. It's a tremendous documentary.

Love to all, Adam Thomson

END OF MESSAGE

"At 12:31 PM 03-11-16, via OE wrote:
>Thanks for this very helpful insight, 
>Dharma.  As we are consumed with the rancor 
>between left and right in this country, the 
>broader view calls us to consider what issues 
>deserve our attention when it comes to being 
>compassionate and responsible world citizens.
>
>Catherine Welch, Denver
>
>From: <mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>Dharmalingam Vinasithamby via OE
>Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2016 7:16 PM
>To: <mailto:LCHockley at gmail.com>Len Hockley ; 
><mailto:laurelcg at aol.com>laurelcg at aol.com ; 
><mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>Order Ecumenical 
>Community ; <mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>Order Ecumenical Community
>Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Salmon: Clinton's relationship to E.I. -Dear Susan
>
>As an outsider, being in the Order/ICA gave me a 
>close-up view of the US and how its citizens 
>related to it. In all those years, beginning 
>with Nixon all the way up to Obama, I’ve seen 
>it invade and destroy nations around the world, 
>releasing waves of refugees and other miseries. 
>But within  the US, people lived in a cocoon 
>that helped them avert their eyes. I remember 
>the Vietnam war protesters and the many young 
>people who fled the US in order not to be driven 
>to kill “gooks” overseas. I noticed that at 
>best, we were silent on this and at worst, 
>disapproving. When I look back, I see that the 
>protesters were the “sensitive and 
>responsive” part that Niebuhr wrote about. I 
>also noticed the hunger among us to cite links 
>to famous figures while pointing out that to 
>live in the “no longer and the not-yet” was 
>to be “nobodies”.  Perhaps this was the 
>effect of consuming the stories meant for our 
>framing and fund-raising strategies.
>
>I see that same hunger now reflected in 
>recalling some distant crossing of trails with 
>Hillary Clinton. Americans have been set up by 
>the political elite to adopt positions around 
>two equally ugly candidates put before them for 
>the exercise of their “democratic rights”. 
>For all the emotions the Republican-Democrat 
>tension evokes in our emails, election after 
>election, that rivalry is a sham. This is a 
>nation ruled by a “single party with two 
>factions”. Whichever you praise or denigrate, 
>the real owners of the land always win. And for 
>the rest of us around the world, we can only 
>wait for the light from this “beacon on the 
>hill” to eventually fade. Then, perhaps, the 
>US will  take its place as an ordinary member in the community of nations.
>
>Dharma
>
>
>On Wednesday, 2 November 2016, 7:33, Len Hockley 
>via OE <oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>
>
>Dido Jon,  The Naked Now by Richard Rohr is required reading!
>
>Len Hockley
>
>On 11/1/2016 2:58 PM, via OE wrote:
>>Love this, Jon. Thanks.
>>
>>Jann
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: 
>><mailto:jonzondo at juno.com>jonzondo at juno.com via 
>>OE <mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net
>>To: isobeljimbish 
>><mailto:isobeljimbish at optusnet.com.au>mailto:isobeljimbish at optusnet.com.au; 
>>oe <mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net
>>Cc: oe <mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net
>>Sent: Tue, Nov 1, 2016 1:37 pm
>>Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Salmon: Clinton's 
>>relationship to E.I. - Dear Susan
>>
>>Dear Group.
>>Jon Elizondo here.  Son of Tony and Ellery.
>>Long time "Order kid" and short time Order adult.
>>
>>This conversation is very important, especially with all the perspectives.
>>I will try to hone in now on one of my key points.
>>The change needed in the system is huge.  Our 
>>current system is incredible broken in so many 
>>ways.  We are a first world country 
>>"purposefully" going backwards by not investing 
>>in our infrastructure nor in our people.
>>In my observation and opinion, much of the 
>>national frustration shows itself in the desire 
>>to elect Trump, or Bernie, or any 
>>alternative.  The "Cry" for change is massive, and will not let up.
>>
>>One of the traps is either/or thinking.
>>
>>one of the ways forward is both/and/plus-more thinking.
>>
>>One of the traps is "personal attacks".
>>
>>one of the ways forward is "come join us at the table".
>>
>>What I know in my bones is that we are all 
>>connected.  That mysterious truth, combined 
>>with my passion & respect, is my key to intentionally moving forward.
>>
>>Walk in Beauty,
>>Jon
>>
>>
>>
>>---------- Original Message ----------
>>From: Isobel Bishop via OE 
>><<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>
>>To: Wilson Priscilla H 
>><<mailto:pris at teamtechpress.com>pris at teamtechpress.com>, 
>>Order Ecumenical Community 
>><<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>
>>Subject: Re: [Oe List ...] Salmon: Clinton's 
>>relationship to E.I. - Dear Susan
>>Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2016 07:23:32 +1100
>>
>>Thankyou for this conversation, colleagues. I appreciate the
>>Honesty, pain and fear expressed in
>>depth,to give us outsiders some real hope.
>>Thankyou all.
>>In peace and love,
>>Isobel
>>Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>On 2 Nov 2016, at 7:02 am, Wilson Priscilla H 
>>via OE <<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>
>>No one has said that better, Randy. You should 
>>put that on Facebook
so we can all copy your words.
>>Priscilla Wilson
>>
>>On Nov 1, 2016, at 2:35 PM, Joyce Sloan via OE 
>><<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>Well said, Randy!!
>>
>>On Nov 1, 2016 2:20 PM, "Randy Williams via OE" 
>><<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>I keep asking, but still have not seen, one 
>>shred of verifiable evidence to substantiate 
>>the charge that Hillary has committed a 
>>criminal act of any sort. She's made serious 
>>mistakes like with the private server, she has 
>>not been as transparent as she could and 
>>perhaps should have been, she got paid a lot of 
>>money for some speeches (but less than some 
>>men), she's flip-flopped on some positions 
>>she's taken like on TPP, she has a 
>>super-healthy ego (an asset for a man but a 
>>huge liability for a woman in our culture), she 
>>didn't play nice when she was First Lady trying 
>>to get health care passed, as Secretary of 
>>State she traveled the world and spoke truth to 
>>power like the Premier of China, and after much 
>>gut-wrenching deliberation and prayer she chose 
>>to stay true to her vow to her husband of "for 
>>better or worse" through "worse." And to add 
>>insult to injury, she decided to run to be the 
>>first woman in the Office of President of the 
>>United States. How dare she. Despise her for 
>>all those things and hate all her positions on 
>>the issues, but don't accuse her of being a 
>>criminal unless you have some rock solid proof 
>>that hours and years and millions of dollars 
>>worth of hearings, investigations and witch 
>>hunts by scores of government agencies, news 
>>media and nondescript malcontents have been 
>>unable to produce. I've heard the rumors, 
>>innuendos, exaggerations, conjecture, gross 
>>distortions and outright lies, everything but 
>>verifiable truth. Got any? Then let's have it. 
>>But double check your sources before you put it 
>>out there because there really are some 
>>malingering, deplorable liars afoot in the land 
>>and a lot of fools are believing them and then 
>>repeating what they heard them say and calling it truth, and it just isn't.
>>Randy
>>Sent from my iPad
>>On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:15 PM, Susan Fertig via 
>>OE <<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>
>>Trump was never my choice, and Hillary is a 
>>criminal--her vision for the country is my 
>>first nightmare. And Trump is just as flawed. 
>>Both of them scare me to death. But neither if 
>>the other candidates is really an option 
>>either. I fear we're about to see this great 
>>American experiment in democracy become 
>>something no less evil than the many kleptocracies around the world.
>>
>>Susan
>>
>>Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid
>>On Nov 1, 2016 11:55 AM, Judi White 
>><<mailto:sophiacircle at gmail.com>sophiacircle at gmail.com> wrote:
>>Well,  what you wrote is what Frumper repeats 
>>over and over. Mist who parrot him do support him.
>>I Personally prefer to read responses to a 
>>candidates vision for this nation.
>>Also I stand firm in ny admiration which  never 
>>ceases, of this woman who has continued in 
>>spite of the unbelievable accusations which are 
>>so blown up out of the real world of truth and 
>>honesty that it is cause for seriously asking "Why?".
>>Why the hell bent mission to destroy a solid 
>>vision for this nation and this planet? There 
>>is no other candidate who shines so brightly 
>>and qualified to be an example for our children 
>>and grandchildren at this time.  Rightly so.
>>
>>On Nov 1, 2016 12:20 PM, "Susan Fertig via OE" 
>><<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>How in the world did you infer that I must be a 
>>Trump supporter from my message?
>>
>>Susan
>>
>>Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid
>>On Nov 1, 2016 7:56 AM, Ken Fisher 
>><<mailto:kenfisher1942 at gmail.com>kenfisher1942 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Dear Susan,
>>
>>Writing to you as a Canadian Christian and 
>>16-year Order member, I am awed by your 
>>commitment to American Republicanism and 
>>conservative Christianity. How in the world did 
>>you spend so much time with the EI/OE/ICA 
>>community and have your world view remain unaffected?
>>
>> From the perspective of Canada, we are 87% 
>> supporters of HRC and the image of America she 
>> represents.  Probably Russia is 87% in favour of Donald.
>>
>>Each and every ‘crime’ that I have read 
>>about that is attributed to Hillary has been 
>>most grandly committed by Republicans in previous Bush administrations.
>>
>>Surely you would agree that Donald Trump is an 
>>out and out racist, sexist, homophobe, 
>>parochial narcissist and most of all a climate 
>>change denier? HRC is none of the above. 
>>Thankfully, she is responsive to both Bernie 
>>and to Elizabeth. We may get out of this mess yet.
>>
>>Your phrase: "only values I see are  abject 
>>greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and 
>>arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent 
>>the law. She has done absolutely nothing to 
>>improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged 
>>yet claims she has in the face of all evidence 
>>to the contrary.” is really the truth that the world sees about Trump.
>>
>>I would invite you to see all that as a projection.
>>
>>Should Trump take ownership of any of the 
>>above, that would be a fine moment of grace. Would you not agree?
>>
>>Margaret Atwood, (a Canadian poet, novelist, 
>>literary critic, essayist, and environmental 
>>activist) describes America in the midst of a 
>>Salem type witch hunt. I agree. It is, at the bottom a war against women.
>>
>>While there are indeed my contradictions in 
>>American society that both the Republican and 
>>Democratic administrations must answer for, the 
>>attached article came closest - for me - in 
>>describing how the Republican voice has 
>>committed itself to an ‘end game’ and it 
>>would seem that indeed, the GOP will ‘end’.
>>
>>Love and best wishes to you, Susan and to all 
>>Trump supporters who have been left without any 
>>vision other than rebellion or depression.
>>
>>We are all responsible. Everyone.
>>
>>Ken in Canada.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>A Republican intellectual explains why the Republican Party is going to die
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>><http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12256510/republican-party-trump-avik-roy>http://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/1 
>>2256510/republican-party-trump -avik-roy
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Nov 1, 2016, at 12:03 AM, Susan Fertig via 
>>OE <<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>
>>Values??? The only values I see are  abject 
>>greed, a pathological allegiance to lies, and 
>>arrogant flaunting of her ability to circumvent 
>>the law. She has done absolutely nothing to 
>>improve the lives of the poor and disadvantaged 
>>yet claims she has in the face of all evidence 
>>to the contrary. I've heard for years about 
>>this possible connection to EI/ICA, and I truly 
>>hope it's not true. It would be a horrible embarrassment to the movement.
>>
>>Susan
>>
>>Sent from my Verizon 4G LTE Droid
>>On Oct 31, 2016 11:22 PM, William Salmon via OE 
>><<mailto:oe at lists.wedgeblade.net>oe at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
>>Colleagues--
>>     So many raise the question concerning 
>> Hillary Clinton's relationship to E.I. I 
>> decided to cast this bread upon the waters. 
>> The first sign is that while I addressed it to 
>> Hillary Clinton, an alternate address popped 
>> up. Consequently, it may really get to her 
>> attention, to that of some aid. May it be a Kool-Aid.
>>     Inner Peace,
>>     Bill
>>
>>Mrs. Hillary Clinton:
>>     It is my prayer that this reaches you 
>> concerning your experience in 5th City, 
>> Chicago, or it could have been in Evanston. 
>> Your Youth Director, Don Jones, must have been 
>> at a training event to become known as RS-I. 
>> About the same time, a large number of us 
>> dedicated ourselves to this renewal movement 
>> that grew from our experience in Chicago 
>> Ghetto to literally embrace the world.
>>     It makes me wonder if your experience 
>> under his leadership influenced the values you 
>> hold dear, and now wish to step onto the 
>> platform of the Presidency to do for our 
>> United States and for the world what was 
>> embraced by the courageous citizens in 5th City.
>>     You carry my prayers during this last turbulent week. You have my vote.
>>     Grace and Peace,
>>     Pastor William E. Salmon
>>     744 So. 10th
>>     Salina, KS  67401
>>     <mailto:wsalmon at cox.net>wsalmon at cox.net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>Wilson Priscilla H
>><mailto:pris at teamtechpress.com>pris at teamtechpress.com
>>www.teamtechpress.com
>>
>>follow me on:
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>>Twitter
>>
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