[Dialogue] Stoicism

[Cynthia Vance]

Well said.  Thank you, Marilyn.

Cynthia Vancefacilitationfla at aol.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Mari Crocker via Dialogue <dialogue at lists.wedgeblade.net>
To: Colleague Dialogue <dialogue at lists.wedgeblade.net>
Cc: Mari Crocker <maricrocker at gmail.com>
Sent: Thu, Jan 20, 2022 8:44 pm
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Stoicism

Hi Dharma,
Such a thought-provoking question.  In mundane terms, I think of myself falling into Stoicism when I say, “Marilyn, just force yourself to do, or accept, or be or………”. In those moments I feel I must do or be because of external expectations or exigencies, not by profound personal intention or choice.  I never studied Zeno, nor heard anything in our OE courses that specifically negated his teachings.  However, I am empowered when I take time to stop and rehearse a different Word from RSI, that I can intentionally take a new attitudinal relationship to my situation, grounded in profound possibility, and say YES to what I have chosen freely.  The latter seems akin to Joseph Campbell’s encouragement “to follow one’s bliss”.
For the many years leading up to, and since (in November) Joe moved to an assisted living memory care facility, I manifested both of these approaches in the extreme. As Joe’s dementia progressed, and I was his 24/7 caregiver, I tried the Stoic approach:  Marilyn, just keep on going, you can handle it all no matter what, and you must.  As you noted, that is unrealistic and guarantees a crash, sooner or later.  And then there is guilt, which deepens the crash of not being able to keep on going.  For me, the Word that I am limited (Bultman); and that is OK (Tillich); that I can decide anew what is needed (Bonhoeffer); and can engage the support of the “sensitive and responsive” who are everywhere (HRNeibuhr) — that has made all the difference.  But it, like the self-talk of the Stoic, is a daily rehearsal, sometimes hourly litany of one’s self-understanding.
Thank you for prompting my reflection on this important question.
Grace, peace, and love — with fond memories of our time in the KL house in 1969/70
Marilyn



On Jan 20, 2022, at 7:27 PM, Dharmalingam Vinasithamby via Dialogue <dialogue at lists.wedgeblade.net> wrote:
Dear colleagues,

I need help with an idea I’m trying to sort out. If you have the time and inclination, I would love to hear from you on the following: 

Saying Yes to life and Stoicism. Stoicism seems to be understood as a relationship to life where you keep going on despite the odds. There is also an inuendo that this may not be humanly possible and that internal pressures will eventually cause the person to crash. What I want to know is, was that the Stoicism that Zeno founded or merely a degraded understanding? Why did we as an Order cast it in a negative light? What was our beef with it? Was it a reaction to the degraded form or were we looking at it in its original sense?
regardsDharma_______________________________________________
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